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Author Topic: GT2871R Upgrade!  (Read 10249 times)

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cobracmdr

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GT2871R Upgrade!
« on: July 31, 2008, 07:22:22 AM »

Well as you all remember I had an oiling issue back in early June of this year.  See post http://www.tgpforums.com/index.php?topic=4833.0  I THOUGHT my nice new turbo had escaped the wrath of the oil pump pickup falling off but unfortunately it started leaking oil out the back a few weeks ago.  Needless to say Adam helped me out and tore it down for a rebuild.  Long story short the turbine seal had rotated in the housing causing the leak, my thrust bearing was shot and the bearing housing had some nice grooves in it from the seal rotating around.  I needed a new bearing housing....well apparently the T25 centers are getting hard to come by and garrett is no longer supporting them and the aftermarket ones are almost non-existent at this time.  Basically unless you have a stockpile of good centers you are going to have to upgrade.  Since I was tired of the wet bearing's tempermental oiling system I decided to bite the bullet and drop the Gs on a brand new Garrett turbo. 

Now you all know that I'm setup to log WB O2 in tuner pro, I have 28 lb ls1 injectors and a walboro 255 liter/hr pump.  I'm set up from the fuel aspect.  So I decided to go a little bigger than the disco potato and got the GT2871R P/N 743347-1 with the .86 A/R turbine housing http://www.turbobygarrett.com/turbobygarrett/catelog/Turbochargers/GT28/GT2871R_743347_1.htm

Now this is not a cheep turbo but I got a nice deal on it from a local tuner shop with a 1 year warrenty so I got out the checkbook and did it, let me tell you I'm glad I did!  I'm set at 12 psi right now and it is faster than the disco was at 14 and maybe 16 psi!  That and the underhood temperatures have dropped...........a lot. 

You're going to need some things to make this work and unlike those of the past (who shall remain nameless)  I'm going to tell you what you need EXACTLY to do this upgrade!  It is really not that hard.  If you are stock you are going to need a tune so use search and find out who to talk to.  Or you can teach yourself with some help from experts, thanks for the help Adam!

First things first you need to buy the turbo and fuel system to support this stuff.  I'm not going to tell you what to do with that here I'm only going to tell you the plumbing aspects.

Ball bearing turbos do not need as much oil as the T series wet bearings we have from the factory (well you guys have I had nothing hahah) really you only need 5-25 psi for a ball bearing turbo.  Most retails will sell the turbo with a -4 AN male restrictor with a 0.035" orifice in it to go from the 60-70 psi the high volume TGP pump throws out.  This goes to a flair fitting that interfaces with the center bearing housing.  You can buy it here if you don't get one with your turbo.  You need it otherwise you are going to push oil out the seals and it will leave blue clouds behind you, and I'm not talking from the tires.

http://www.atpturbo.com/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Product_Code=ATP-OIL-021&Category_Code=ATP-OIL1

Next you need a -4 AN female oil feed line, I had the tuner shop make me one but you can buy them.  I had mine made 3 ft long but I think 2.5 ft would have been plenty as I have extra length.  You can also buy this directly from ATP turbo here:

http://www.atpturbo.com/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Product_Code=ATP-OIL-014&Category_Code=ATP-OIL1

Ok now you need to get some fittings to hook up to you stock oil feel line down by the ignition module.  For this you are going to need a -4 AN aluminum to 1/8 NPT male Adapter, a 1/8 NPT female copper or aluminum coupler (get this in the plumbing section of lowes or home depot) and a -4 AN Steel to 1/8 NPT adapter.  You also need some permatex high temperature thread sealant from autozone.  Basically you stick the two adapters into the 1/8 NPT coupler with the thread sealer and tighten them together.  Then take the AL adapter and put it into the oil feed line and the steel one into the stock oil feed line coming out by the filter.  Then the other end of the oil feed line goes to the restrictor from above and into the turbo CBH.  Here are some parts from summit's catalog:

http://store.summitracing.com/partdetail.asp?autofilter=1&part=AER%2DFBM2001&N=700+115&autoview=sku
http://store.summitracing.com/partdetail.asp?autofilter=1&part=AER%2DFBM2512&N=700+115&autoview=sku
http://store.summitracing.com/partdetail.asp?autofilter=1&part=EAR%2D991001ERL&N=700+115&autoview=sku

Next you need a drain back.  The turbo has a 2 bolt flange for the drain with a gasket.  Most of the retailers have an aluminum 2 bolt flange with the -10AN male fitting on the end.  You can buy this from them and get a -10 AN to 5/8 barb fitting to clamp to our stock drain back line.  Like this but not exactly I'll post the earl p/n when I get home but you get the idea.  You need 8 mm 1.5 thread pitch socket head cap screws about .5 " long to hook up to the center housing.

http://store.summitracing.com/partdetail.asp?autofilter=1&part=AER%2DFBM1514&N=700+115&autoview=sku

or if you got $$$ you can get this nice one piece deal from ATP turbo

http://www.atpturbo.com/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Product_Code=ATP-OIL-031&Category_Code=GTBB

Ok you got the oil taken care of.  Next you need coolant.  I went with (12) inch braided stainless -6 an female lines going to a -6 AN Male to 14 MM adapter and into the housing of the turbo.  Then on the other end of the stainless line you need a -6 an male to 3/8 Barb adapter.  Do this for both coolant lines and use 3/8 transmission cooler hose from autozone to clamp to the stock feed and heater return pipe.  Again use thread sealer on the fittings going into the housing, thread sealer is not needed for the AN fittings as they are designed to seal fluid.  Here are some more links to parts at summit I used:

http://store.summitracing.com/partdetail.asp?autofilter=1&part=RUS%2D658490&N=700+400081+115&autoview=sku
http://store.summitracing.com/partdetail.asp?autofilter=1&part=EAR%2D9919DFHERL&N=700+115&autoview=sku
http://store.summitracing.com/partdetail.asp?autofilter=1&part=RUS%2D670300&N=700+115&autoview=sku

Now once you get all that stuff together don't go putting it on the turbo just yet.  You are going to have to orient the turbine and compressor housings for our application.  Basically you are going to have to get it so the oil feed is on top but slightly off center towards the drivers side of the car.  This will put the drain back pointing towards the pan and not the AC lines (I found that out that hard way)  You also have to watch your coolant lines, the coolant feed (passenger side of the turbo) has to be pointing up so the line will go over the 4 bolt flange when the turbo is installed.  To reorient your housings take a 1/2 wrench and loosen all the bolts on the turbine and compressor, you don't have to take them out just loosen them so you can rotate the housings.  Your going to have to take off the wastegate clip and stuff too. 

Now put your fittings and lines on the turbo, plop it into the car and using your 8 mm 1.5 thread pitch bolts attach two bolts washers, lock washers and nuts to the 4 bolt flange but leave them loose.  This is a pain as our stock t25 housings have threads which makes this easier but the GT2871R has thru holes.  If I ever take mine out again I'm going to drill and helicoil the damn flange so I dont have to futz with nuts and washers.  It is a pain and took the longest to do.  Then loosely bolt up the downpipe.  I had trouble threading one of the bolts and you might have to slot the dp holes a bit to make it easier.  I did not just left all the bolts loose and eventually I got them all in without cross threading.  The flange is supposed to be the same 5 bolt we had from the factory but who knows what ASC's manufacturing tolerances were on the downpipe probably crappy. 

Oh you are going to need a filter since the turbo has a 3" inlet.  I went with a K&N RB 9010 I think I'll double check this and update if it is different.  All and all it when pretty well once you get the lines all configured!  The outlet of the compressor is 2 inch so the stock intercooler coupler will bolt up just fine.  BTW I did not use the 4 bolt flange gasket even though it came with one and I have no exhaust leaks.  Then again I had my crossver flange decked at the machine shop at work a few months back.  Your results may vary so beware you might need the gasket if your flange is warped.   

Enough of this on with the pictures and video at the end!  Nothing crazy just idle and my setup!

Ken




















« Last Edit: July 31, 2008, 07:39:01 AM by cobracmdr »
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1989 Turbo Grand Prix - missed very much!!!!
2010 Camaro 2SS/RS LS3 M6 12.01 @117 mph - Inferno Orange Metallic, long tubes, x pipe, Cat back, all 3" pipe 321 SS, vararam intake, LC-1, diy tune
01 Grand Prix GTP - 3.4 pulley, plog, k&n drop in, u-bend & resonator delete, tuned
03 Suzuki SV650N - zx10 shock, racetech springs/emulators, streetfighter

killinprixs

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Re: GT2871R Upgrade!
« Reply #1 on: July 31, 2008, 07:53:59 AM »

Great job looks like it was built by a perfectionist... o wait your an engineer!  what are you hopin for the 1320?
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cobracmdr

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Re: GT2871R Upgrade!
« Reply #2 on: July 31, 2008, 08:07:03 AM »

hahah yeah I went a bit overboard but if you are going to spend a chunk of money for a BB turbo you might as well go all out on the rest of the stuff.  Anyways 1320 lets see I ran a 14.56 on the disco with a hurt motor, now I have a nice turbo cam, exhaust with no mufflers and this big ol turbo now.....I'd be pretty disappointed if I can't get a low 14 out of the car at 12 psi.  I'm hoping for high 13's at 12 without having to crank it up more.  I "accidently" turned it up to 15-16 last night and it was damn fast.  So I'm pretty confident at 16 psi (for a track time only) I could hit 13's for sure.  I'm going to dyno it soon too I need to know what this thing is making for power ;)

Ken
« Last Edit: July 31, 2008, 08:07:55 AM by cobracmdr »
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1989 Turbo Grand Prix - missed very much!!!!
2010 Camaro 2SS/RS LS3 M6 12.01 @117 mph - Inferno Orange Metallic, long tubes, x pipe, Cat back, all 3" pipe 321 SS, vararam intake, LC-1, diy tune
01 Grand Prix GTP - 3.4 pulley, plog, k&n drop in, u-bend & resonator delete, tuned
03 Suzuki SV650N - zx10 shock, racetech springs/emulators, streetfighter

meltboy11

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Re: GT2871R Upgrade!
« Reply #3 on: July 31, 2008, 08:13:31 AM »

damn that sounds good... so I think I decided instead of storing my TGP this winter, I am just gona drop it off at your place in october and pick it up next year sounding like that.... lol!!
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cobracmdr

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Re: GT2871R Upgrade!
« Reply #4 on: July 31, 2008, 08:18:42 AM »

I know I'm surprised it sounds so good.  :laugh:  The exhaust is sooooo hacked up!  All it is a twin cam exhaust I got at the u pullit for 20 bucks with the muffler cut off:)  I left the resonator on it and put those nice gibson tips on the extension pipes I had welded on.  I think I might have $150 into the exhaust including the 50 bucks each for the stainless tips.  The cam helps with the sound too haha.  Come on down Jim!  I gotta give you a ring and see when you want to hit ESTA.  BTW the car will be at Spedie Fest in the car show this Sunday if you are heading down.  Spedie Fest is at Otsenango park (can't spell it!)  Big hot air balloon rally and spedie cookoffs too.

Ken
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1989 Turbo Grand Prix - missed very much!!!!
2010 Camaro 2SS/RS LS3 M6 12.01 @117 mph - Inferno Orange Metallic, long tubes, x pipe, Cat back, all 3" pipe 321 SS, vararam intake, LC-1, diy tune
01 Grand Prix GTP - 3.4 pulley, plog, k&n drop in, u-bend & resonator delete, tuned
03 Suzuki SV650N - zx10 shock, racetech springs/emulators, streetfighter

TGed

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Re: GT2871R Upgrade!
« Reply #5 on: July 31, 2008, 10:20:17 AM »

What RPM's are you spooling up at now?  When I upgraded mine, the powerband changed slightly with supporting mods.
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GOT2B GM

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Re: GT2871R Upgrade!
« Reply #6 on: July 31, 2008, 10:21:57 AM »

as usual nice work! and thanks for the write-up
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Matt Shantz - 1990 Pontiac Turbo Grand Prix COLD A/C 80K mi, KAZ Hot Tuned, Birchtrax'ed +  a few mods  ......... 14.6829 @ 95.11 mph

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Re: GT2871R Upgrade!
« Reply #7 on: July 31, 2008, 10:23:16 AM »

ohhh where is your o2 located now?
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Matt Shantz - 1990 Pontiac Turbo Grand Prix COLD A/C 80K mi, KAZ Hot Tuned, Birchtrax'ed +  a few mods  ......... 14.6829 @ 95.11 mph

cobracmdr

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Re: GT2871R Upgrade!
« Reply #8 on: July 31, 2008, 10:46:33 AM »

What RPM's are you spooling up at now?  When I upgraded mine, the powerband changed slightly with supporting mods.

I think it is starting to spool around 2500-3k rpm and full boost by 4250 k?  Does that sound like yours?  It actually spools faster and sooner than my disco hyrid did, which is to be expected :)
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1989 Turbo Grand Prix - missed very much!!!!
2010 Camaro 2SS/RS LS3 M6 12.01 @117 mph - Inferno Orange Metallic, long tubes, x pipe, Cat back, all 3" pipe 321 SS, vararam intake, LC-1, diy tune
01 Grand Prix GTP - 3.4 pulley, plog, k&n drop in, u-bend & resonator delete, tuned
03 Suzuki SV650N - zx10 shock, racetech springs/emulators, streetfighter

cobracmdr

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Re: GT2871R Upgrade!
« Reply #9 on: July 31, 2008, 10:51:33 AM »

ohhh where is your o2 located now?

Oh yeah :laugh:  when I installed my LC-1 I had a bung welded at the bottom of the down pipe at the bend by the sway bar.  I kept going through narrow band o2's for a while when tuning I got sick of it and hooked up the simulated narrowband output on the LC-1 to a stock connector and plugged it into stock harness.  So basically I have the LC-1 giving WB to the dash O-meter, the ECM for data logging and running the car on the simulated narrow.  1 O2 does it all!

Ken
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1989 Turbo Grand Prix - missed very much!!!!
2010 Camaro 2SS/RS LS3 M6 12.01 @117 mph - Inferno Orange Metallic, long tubes, x pipe, Cat back, all 3" pipe 321 SS, vararam intake, LC-1, diy tune
01 Grand Prix GTP - 3.4 pulley, plog, k&n drop in, u-bend & resonator delete, tuned
03 Suzuki SV650N - zx10 shock, racetech springs/emulators, streetfighter

TGed

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Re: GT2871R Upgrade!
« Reply #10 on: July 31, 2008, 10:52:44 AM »

I can boost about 14 psi at around 2500-3000 rpm's.  ;)
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Re: GT2871R Upgrade!
« Reply #11 on: July 31, 2008, 11:07:44 AM »

What is that line coming off the port on your fuel rail?
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cobracmdr

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Re: GT2871R Upgrade!
« Reply #12 on: July 31, 2008, 11:22:19 AM »

I can boost about 14 psi at around 2500-3000 rpm's.  ;)

Nice you must have an automatic?  I just looked at my 4th gear highway pull log from last night, full boost by 4350. 

If I get line lock and don't mind smoking my cluch I can do a nice clutch boost for the track;)  I'm not that cool where I can heal toe break boost a 5 speed.   :icon_rolleyes: hahahah

Ken
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1989 Turbo Grand Prix - missed very much!!!!
2010 Camaro 2SS/RS LS3 M6 12.01 @117 mph - Inferno Orange Metallic, long tubes, x pipe, Cat back, all 3" pipe 321 SS, vararam intake, LC-1, diy tune
01 Grand Prix GTP - 3.4 pulley, plog, k&n drop in, u-bend & resonator delete, tuned
03 Suzuki SV650N - zx10 shock, racetech springs/emulators, streetfighter

cobracmdr

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Re: GT2871R Upgrade!
« Reply #13 on: July 31, 2008, 11:24:12 AM »

What is that line coming off the port on your fuel rail?

A spare stock oil feed line going to my electronic fuel pressure sender, I monitor fuel pressure in cabin.......that was the gauge that changes color in the video.  Pretty handy actually helped me troubleshoot a lot of stuff from bad fuel pump relay to not enough fuel pump capacity.

Ken
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1989 Turbo Grand Prix - missed very much!!!!
2010 Camaro 2SS/RS LS3 M6 12.01 @117 mph - Inferno Orange Metallic, long tubes, x pipe, Cat back, all 3" pipe 321 SS, vararam intake, LC-1, diy tune
01 Grand Prix GTP - 3.4 pulley, plog, k&n drop in, u-bend & resonator delete, tuned
03 Suzuki SV650N - zx10 shock, racetech springs/emulators, streetfighter

meltboy11

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Re: GT2871R Upgrade!
« Reply #14 on: July 31, 2008, 02:37:41 PM »

Can't, goin campin this weekend... not to mention I aint even driven the TGP in like at least 3 weeks. I was gona take it out today for a qucik spin, but it was raining. I don't wana take it to the track or put a lot on it til I get the stuff wrong with it fixed. But right now my efforts are goin into the 89 first, it needs 1 rear strut bad, I can put all my weight down on the drivers side rear and it doesn't move, so I will just replace both cuz I don't see a point in replacing only one. I also might get some new mufflers for it as it is pretty loud right now. But I kinda wana just wait, cuz I was plannin on just takin the TGPs exhaust and putting it on the 89 and building a new one for the TGP. I just don't have the funds right now, so it looks like the TGP won't be gettin too much more action this summer sadly... :(
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90 TGP ~70k miles 5/15
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