What does it take to run 13 seconds?

[Jeff M]

From every forum I've been in; the GTech is not and has not been an acceptable method of verifying a cars performance.  Especially when extraordinary times are in question.  You may say it's accurate to within 1/10th of a second but what happens if the road you are on has a downward slope to it?  Or the unit is not perfectly (0.00) levelled before you run the car?.

It depends on how you use it, I know to level mine and if you own one(?) it tells you/won?t work if its not close enough to being level! I know guys who ran these at the track and were within 2/10s, some off as much as 4/10ths but those are fast SyTys that pull the front end up enough to add the G-Force of earth's gravity to skew the G-Tech reading, the TGP don't lift that high :lol:

I agree Jeff normally is willing to help and give pointers for improvement but unfortunately has not replied to my significant post effort on the "Take the TGP to the Next Step of Performance" thread posted over a month ago...  :(  It was the most-viewed thread for the last Month, but maybe he missed it...?

You can make a significant posts if you like 8) , sure was enjoyable for many and that's all good, but first I am not sure why I am committed to reply to everything that could be talked about in such a vast subject, and that could be a huge amount if I look over the last 14 years for me at least.  Next I am not done with what I would recommend to people :!:  for their own mods to be done or anything I come up with or can offer up, like here there were those thinking headers, then told not to for good reasons, then heads/cams but I at least saved people from jumping the gun on that one until they resolve the stock turbo backpressure problem.  I got too much going on that keeps me busy 20 hours a day and some times many 40+ hour days, but soon as I find info that is helpful/proven from tests (is anyone else going to run tests other than me????), I will only tell what I know for sure, and ask what I don't!

And for the record I am also not saying his car isn't that fast, only pointing out that he hasn't provided sufficient evidence to prove that it is that fast, and when making an uncommon claim (i.e. a 13 second TGP and/or a TGP running 1.5 seconds faster 0-60 than similarly equipped cars), the burden of proof lies on the person making the claim.

Uhhh, what?s my motivation here??? :roll:   Mike Gardner with a stock turbo, upgraded heads and cam/100 octane ran a corrected 13.56 and I have scanned time slips, I ran a 13.89 years ago with stock turbo and stock engine complete and have a time slip, then ran a 13.3 with a friends here, but once those are shown, what significance will that provide :shock: but I think it would be easier just to save me the time and stick up a BS sign :lol: on me, I won?t take offense 8), there will be a time when I will stick those up on my web site, but the times so far are what they are, veriefied or not, hell I could borrow a few 10 second time slips from my truck and say I was driving a TGP :lol: , without a movie clip, who?s to know :roll: .

Got to go, long list as always, just boxed up today an entire engine/all parts and took to the machine shop for work, cleaning and stripping and painting what is left here tonight with subframe, a-arms, tranny lines, power steering lines, radiator overflow and windshield tank clean, sand blast some aluminum parts and coat, got to pay for an eBay item I just won, need to reply to more emails, and just a NOTE, 2 months ago I cleaned out and filed all the emails in my Inbox, tonight (2 months later) my Inbox is back up to 688, fact!!  I spend 80% of my time on-line doing emails fixing TGP and TSTE owners (and all those "I want to turbo XXX :lol: ) so I am sorry I can't be enjoying talking tech as much as I would like here :cry:

Jeff M

[ShuGTXTurbo]

I will post my times up when I go to the track on april 4th I better be quicker than 14.7.  Sorry for starting a post argument between JeffM and everybody just trying to help a little bit

[Jeff M]

I will post my times up when I go to the track on april 4th I better be quicker than 14.7.  Sorry for starting a post argument between JeffM and everybody just trying to help a little bit

Cool 8) .  I know a few around on these boards that run 14's, anywhere from 14.2 best to 15.3 worst, and I love this as it snarls people all the time like WTF!!  In 1989-90 NEW TGPs where tested and ran from a 15.3 best to 16.3 worst, 7 second 0-60 best and 8.18 worst, all on TGPs with nearly new miles.  So given this, add some miles and years to these TGPs and those stock times better vary even more!!!!!!!  Each time I take apart another engine I find more reasons for contributors to variations in acceleration times; carbon buildup beat into the valve lip area and the valve seat in the head, some showing a little blowby/leakage, some showing a lot.  Next, ring lands filled with burnt on carbon reducing the sealing effect when holding in a combustion cycle.  Dark oil stain marks at the entrance to the head?s intake port, showing the port matching being off from the lower intake, some being worse than others from casting and assembly variations.  I can go on, but add things from traction at the cement/asphalt (tire pressure, tire compound/old hard rubber/new sticky, wider 245mm tires than others, or not etc, lack of throttle control  :roll:  ), brakes dragging in the back (frozen?), tranny condition from old fluid and a mostly plugged pump screen limiting fluid pressure and volume, even worn clutches, or someone burning the piss out of one tire around the corner so they only spin one tire on a straight take off when both once spun/pulled together.  More variations such as fuel quality (when tested, 75% of Detroit Gas Stations FAILED the posted octane on their pumps?.too expensive for the State to take them all to court :evil: ), to oil quality (old has more evaporation/blowby, along with the obvious), the list goes on and on but the value and point I am trying to offer here is to NOT obsesses with a lesser et time than someone else mod?d the same or not as much, many variables, many more not listed!

As for things getting tight around here, it happens :) , I don?t need or can be friends with everyone, I do what I can to help people run right before they run faster, and help in other areas when I can, we all do, I just don?t obsesses of get disgusted with my car not being perfect, that?s my job/hobby/passion to make it.....welllll close to perfect as I can.

As for the desperation to see some 13 second times, those guys can go to the 60 degree forum and pester them there as they have 13 second turbo 3.1/3.2L vehicles :lol: .

Jeff M

[m6amba]

i sure hope im faster than a 14.7 too!  lol  i just spent over 800$ on parts for an engine rebuild and 850 on a gt28 turbo SUPPOSED to be good for 350 hp....flows 505cfm :)  although i am runnin really junkie tires   for now  im spinnin the crap out of them now so i can get nice ones for summer  thinkin nitto extreme 555's my budyy has them on his GTP and can barley break them loose on dry blacktop.....anybody else have an opinion on them?    (since that is sorta off topic u can send it to my PM box if ya want) :wink:


btw im workin on gettin all my part numbers and stuff written down so i can put it in here for all to see everything i have down to my car

[m6amba]

sry im not sure if i made it clear that the 800$ i spent was on parts not labor........my friend and i did all the work :lol:

[maximage]

The Nitto's are a great choice. Just be warry on the transmission o this modded beast, unless you go 5-speed.

[90TGP]

Traction is my issue, or lack of traction. Got to replace those R-Rated pepboys tires this year.

[m6amba]

i do plan on goin 5 speed....as soon as my tranny blows.....not that i want it to but when it does im just gonna put in the getrag 282....and since greg is comin here in may to do his i will have a little know how on how to do it...plus i can always ask skalor to help me with mine too since he is gonna help with gregs..... :lol:

[ShuGTXTurbo]

might want to plan on doing a drive axle upgrade to.  more power will break the stock axles clean in half if you dont have any slippage.

[god910]

Who's making axle's?  I know I'll need some shortly.

[maximage]

Any driveshaft shop that can do halfshafts.

[TGPilot]

might want to plan on doing a drive axle upgrade to.  more power will break the stock axles clean in half if you dont have any slippage.

Says who? Have you ever heard of a TGP half-shaft even bending from high torque let alone breaking? When I had the half-shafts rebuilt for the 5-speed swap the driveline shop that did them said "they looked strong as hell" and he was going to try them on his 550 HP Karman Ghia drag car. He told me the CV knuckles could use a higher tensile strength needle bearing in the rollers...but the axles themselves would handle more than a 3.1 Turbo motor could throw at them... 8)

[90TGP]

Don't you just love overkill?  :lol:

[dbtk2]

might want to plan on doing a drive axle upgrade to.  more power will break the stock axles clean in half if you dont have any slippage.

Says who? Have you ever heard of a TGP half-shaft even bending from high torque let alone breaking?

Thats what I was thinking.  My dad didn't break any halfshafts in his GTP until the day he ran a 12.40.  The only reason he broke it then is because beating the piss out of it.  He broke it on the very first run (but at that point we weren't sure that he had broken it or no) and he kept making runs, and kept getting faster each time, even with the broken halfshaft.  He even ran his best of 12.40 with the broken half-shaft.  And he still drove the car home 70+ miles after that.  So you're gonna tell me that a TGP with SIGNIFICANTLY less torque (my dads GTP has ~500ft.lbs.) is going to snap them clean in half, when my dads GTP barely even cracked ONE halfshaft.  Yeah, the TGP's halfshafts are a LITTLE more weak because they are slightly smaller, but you can't tell me they are that much weaker!

Shawn

[m6amba]

i have 2 half shafts layin around "just in case" lol  i dont think im ever gonna need them but hey they are here for me to say that i have them....lol.......anybody want them?  :roll: