Ok peoples...
I have purchased (today) and will be picking up (next week) a 1989 GP SE with a 2.8 litre 5 Speed. I will be taking many photos and writting up a how to guide that I will talk to Waskie about hosting. Otherwise I will print up a How To manual that I will provide to those who need it. This will be an 1990 TGP 4T60 Automatic to 5-Speed Swap if you haven't figured that out already.
If anyone has any pointers for me before I do this swap as to what you would like to specifically see, or how you would like to see it...let me know.
Peace... 8)
I have no problem giving you some space for this if waskie won't accomodate you, but I'm sure he will.
Chris
Good deal. Thanks Chris. I should have everything together by the 28th of July if all goes as planned. I can't wait. The auto tranny in it now can't handle the 8-9 lbs of boost I am putting to it now...slips and shutters bad in first until it locks into 2nd. Bye Bye automatic...hello bend axles :roll:
You can have all the space you need.
Hey, I was reading about the 5-speed swap and had a question. I was under the impression that a 5-speed would not work well with our cars ( I believe someone asked that question on the old board). Will a 5-speed work, and which one would work? Thanx..cuz I have been considering this for a while.
JTown...
What wouldn't work? The only thing that may be a problem is what the ECU senses and I need to verify with JeffM. It sould be just fine and work like any other Auto to Manual swap I have ever done with cars in the past. I will let you know how mine turns out... 8)
I'm not sure how much help Jeff will be able to warrant. He has recieved this request before, but has not had much time to look into what is different. To work properly, you may need to ground an orange wire into the P/N switch, which tells the ecm the car is in gear. Otherwise it won' t do over 3k rpm. Other than that, the transmission tells the ECM which gear its in, and when it changes, and the Torque conveter lockup. As far as error codes for not having a trans? I don't think there are any.
Chris
Quote from: Chris AP/N switch, which tells the ecm the car is in gear. Otherwise it won' t do over 3k rpm. Other than that, the transmission tells the ECM which gear its in, and when it changes, and the Torque conveter lockup. As far as error codes for not having a trans? I don't think there are any.
Chris
talk to Eclipse... He did a swap into his cutlass
go to my site and click on the link http://www.geocites.com/ste_turbo
ohh my freakin goodness jeorge that avater is sooooooooo ferakin funny where did you find that....rofl......
Will do...thanks guys.
8)
When you do the swap, why not rewire the P/N safety switch to a clutch switch, so it prevents engagement of the starter unless the clutch is depressed.
Quote from: corvetteWhen you do the swap, why not rewire the P/N safety switch to a clutch switch, so it prevents engagement of the starter unless the clutch is depressed.
You can rewire the starter solenoid part of the Neut Saftey switch(NSS) to do so. But, the NSS has several functions and one of them is to tell the ECM by grounding the orange wire that its in gear. It also connects the backup lights and allows the trunk release to work.
Chris
Hey Chris...
I will be looking real hard at the wiring diagrams for both cars to see what will be compatible. Thanks much for the info... 8)
TGPilot,
If you really want to impress me....get the "up shift" light on the dash to work. It is in the Tach circle under the top portion of the tach. I had one on a Fiero GT, the darn thing seemed to stay on most of the time :mrgreen:
Send me your address (e-mail), may stop by later this week. Father is in town, will be leaving for Ohio Sat.
Thomas
Also let me know If I should make a call to someone in Denver......
I would love to see pictures of a complete 5 speed swap into a 1989 or 1990 TGP just so I know. For all of those guys on the other board who said this shit was easy...PISS OFF!!!! I will finish this friggin' swap...but it isn't FUCKIN' EASY!!!! :crazyeyes: Now that I am done venting...let me go get some band-aids for my busted knuckles! A little :drinking: will do the trick too!
Want to do it to my car when you're done!? :)
Sure....$2000 and you supply all the parts. 8)
OK kids... I did a dry fit of the shift linkage and the turbo manifold and guess what???? It looks like it will clear fine. The Downpipe is just barely in contact with the stud that mounts the linkage to the tranny, but I have a feeling that when the downpipe is hooked to the tail-pipe it will hold it up.
I am going to have to get different short shafts for the drive line, but it looks like the donor cars shafts are the ones. Of course the donor cars CV joints are cooked :cry:
I cut the holes tonight for the shift linkage and the slave cylinder. Ohhhh what fun that was!! :roll:
The Turbo used the Auto Tranny's cradle to support the back of the turbo and I am fabricating two support rods with 3/8" rolled stainless tube.
What a project... 8)
ps...make sure you buy the tranny input shaft pilot bearing before you put everything together...don't be a dip-shit like me tonight! I have to pick one up tomorrow now.
Quote from: TGPilot
What a project... 8)
ps...make sure you buy the tranny input shaft pilot bearing before you put everything together...don't be a dip-shit like me tonight! I have to pick one up tomorrow now.
Pilot bearing? Are you sure? the 282 shouldn't use one, the way the shaft is supported internally it doesn't need the extra support of a pilot bearing. But, ya never know i could be wrong.
chris
Hey Chris...
I have never seen a manual tranny that didn't take a pilot bearing or bushing of some sort. I called Pontiac, who then called GM who wound up confirming that there is no bearing on the crank end of the input shaft. I would have looked at the old motor, but I already sold that last week. Oh well, live and learn :?
Thanks though for pointing that out... 8)
It's IN!!!! :spin: The tranny that is. Got it in and got it running. Found a pretty good oil leak that I caused in between the oil pressure sending unit housing and the oil filter mount. Had to remove this assembly to do the front motor mount and the gasket was dried up....should have known better :oops: I should have a write up here soon. I would like to actually enjoy the fruits of my labor before I do though... 8)
I don't recommend this to anyone who isn't a qualified mechanic! When I find one I'll let you know... :drinking:
Wheres the love - you dont need to leave every time I show up to help. :D
I am sure you were more relieved than disappointed that I was on parts runs everytime you and your STE showed up!!! :lol: :lol: I still have some minor tinkering to do...but for the most part she goes forward! :shock:
How about reverse? :shock:
Quote from: TGPilot
I don't recommend this to anyone who isn't a qualified mechanic! When I find one I'll let you know... :drinking:
yeah i had no idea what i was getting into before i did mine. i finished the swap about a month and a half ago and everything is great now. i also had to do it twice in a row because the 3.1 that i bought with the getrag ended up knocking really bad around 300 miles later....so i put the original engine back in with the Getrag. the worst part of the swap i thought was mounting the brake pedal. i decided that i didn't want to cut the original pedal. and cutting the hole for the clutch master was kind of a bitch because i left the brake booster in. a Dremel with a flexshaft worked great for that tho. the most tedious were all the gaskets, i ended up doing plenum, tb, valve cover, timing cover, water pump, rear main seal, oil pan, and oil drive o-ring seal. but now that i've done it twice, i think i could do a 5-speed conversion no problem now. the only thing i haven't done is the clutch starter switch and the new engine wiring harness doesn't match my old A/C compressor. btw did you use your cars original engine wiring harness? i used the one that came with my 3.1/Getrag, everything from the firewall out was replaced. i didn't have to do anything with the gear selector switch. i'm sure the shift light should work but i don't think there is a bulb in there. i don't plan on puttin' one in either heh heh. let us know how your car does after you break the clutch in.....
joshua
I am using the original TGP wiring harness. I need to wire the P/Neutral switch because I think it is pissing off the ECM that it sees the car in Park and it then sees speed registering and other inputs...boost, throttle, etc. I get a Service Engine Soon light everytime I come to a stop for the first time after starting it. I am going to wire it right this weekend to include the clutch switch. She hauls ass though! The motor spins up faster too without having that lead weight called a torque converter hooked to it... 8)
Quote from: TGPilotShe hauls ass though! The motor spins up faster too without having that lead weight called a torque converter hooked to it... 8)
that's awesome :) i remeber i could hardly even spin the tires back when my car was automatic....but now.....whoa...i can spin MAD tires in 1st gear and even barks them good going into second. there was a thread about spinning tires on here a while ago and i was surprised to see that alot of TGP's couldn't really do it? i'm betting your 5-speed TGP would produce some nice white clouds....oh wait don't do that i don't have $350 to send you for a new clutch :) i'd love to hear what your 1/4 times are..
joshua
I am going to break the clutch in the rest of the way this week and take her to the track next weekend for some runs...we shall see what she does... 8)
Well now that I have decided to keep my TGP. I have started taking it apart to start he swap. This might be a start of a documented post of all if my screw ups. I have never worked on a front wheel drive set up before.
I am going to approach it in an elementary fashion. I have removed the brake assemblys. I am sizing up the axels to remove them both. I see that there are four bolts behind the rotor set up I guess I have to remove
them. My question is do I have to remove that monster nut that is in the center of the shaft on the outside to get the shaft out. I need to know before I go spend the money to get a socket that fits. Any help at all is appreciated, Thanks Guys
no you don't have to remove the axle nut just to get the shafts out. the axle/hub assembly can come straight out of the strut/knuckle. remove the brakes, undo the 4 bolts, and use a slide hammer to smack the axles out of the trans. the axle/hub assembly comes right out. BUT, you WILL have to seperate the axle from the hub in order to put your hubs on the manual shafts tho. if you are using your original hubs on the manual shafts than you should seperate axle from the hub before you pull the auto axles out. you will need that big socket and a 2-jaw puller to do this. then you can leave the hubs in (leave those four bolts alone). after they are separated just use the slide hammer to get the axles out of the tranny. pop the lower ball joint (so you can swing the strut/knuckle assy. out a little) and pull the axles out. be careful not to seperate the CV joints during installation/reinstallation. now is a good time to replace the axle seals in the trans. for reinstallation, lube the splines and seal then push the manual axles into the tranny by grabbing the inner CV joint w/both hands and shoving it into the tranny. make sure it is fully seated. then reinstall the outer end of the axle into the already mounted hubs. tighten the big nut to spec and do the ball joint, brakes, and you should be good to go. both axle shafts will need to be replaced because they are shorter that the autmatic shafts. the shafts are available at Checker or Advance etc....you could probably even use your auto shafts as cores. you WILL need a slide hammer to get the axles out of the transmission tho. i bought a 9lb slide hammer from the harbor freight tool store in ft.collins,CO for like $18 bucks and it works great. it sounds kinda hard but it really isn't. now that i've done it a couple times i could probably change both axles within an hour. if you need any more help ask away
joshua
I wouldn't even mess with the 4 bolts in the hub. Save yourself the trouble and get the big socket. Usually the splined shaft will slide out of the hub, but sometimes you need to tap it. Once in many many axle operation I had one get stuck so bad i had to whack the crap out of it with a hammer. My HUGE puller wouldn't get it out.
As for getting the axles out of the tranny, I usually use a long pry bar. You have to be careful though you do not pry on the trans case and bend it. I also use the pry bar to tap the axle from behind with a hammer. I rarely use a slide hammer to get the axles out.
BY NO MEANS AM I SAYING THAT JOSHUA'S METHODS ARE WRONG!
I'm just saying what i've gotten used to and has worked well for me! :)
A shaft change on a TGP goes pretty fast for me. Undo the balljoint nut, pop it loose, undo the spindle nut (with my cordless impact of course) grab the caliaper and pull the hub/strut assy out as the shaft splines slide out, set that end out of the way and pop out the other end
Thanks for the help guys!!! I managed to get the shafts out tonight and I am ready to start unbolting the transmission itself, Is there anything that would be qa hinderance to me getting to the bell housing bolts, crossover pipe maybe? Anyone have a pretty smoth technique for this stage?
Hey Barry...
I dropped the entire sub-frame out of the car with the motor, tranny, and struts connected. It is a bit more work but saves alot of it in the end too! Without everything out of the way your are going to play hell trying to mount the hydralic clutch assembly to the firewall. I had everything out of the way to include hanging the PMIII off to the side which made it much easier to shape the hole. There is a hidden bolt that threads in from the passengers side of the bell housing down between the block and the tranny if I remember correctly... 8)
i pulled my engine and tranny together right out the top and seperated them when i had it sitting on the gargage floor. seemed really easy that way.
joshua