Okay I just got my prior reman PMIII from Jeff this week, just got around to installing it yesterday, and finishing the job today- my GOD I am the new member of the I HATE PMIII CLUB! After installing the new PMIII, I bled the brakes today, but when I tried to let the fluid out of the bleeders on BOTH of the rear wheels, no fluid or air came out. What is the deal with this? I bled the fronts, and they cooperated normally. What is going on with my rears? Also, now when I go drive the car and step on the brakes, I can hear a "hissing" sound, and the brake pedal feels firm at first, then after the hiss, the brake pedal drops a little bit. It has never done ANY of this stuff prior to replacing the PMIII. The rear bleeders worked when I bought the car back in July. Also, I haven't driven the car in about 3 weeks if that makes any difference.
Please help me!
Oh, also when I had the REAR end in the air, when I step on the brakes, the REAR brakes DON'T work- the rear wheels keep spinning when I step on the brakes.
Any ideas?
I have said it on here or there before and I guess I"ll say it again.. When replacing the PMI bleeding the entire brake system is a joke. It's allot of work and a lot of fluid with often poor results.
I am on my 3rd PMI and have only barley pooped the bleeder valves open after driving a while just to see if I had air. No air. BLEED the PMI before you hook up the lines. DON'T EVEN PUT THE LINES IN THE HOLES. Thats master cylinder replacement 101. No I am not ASE certified but I did stay in a Holiday in last night. :icon_lol: Never install a master cylinder and hook up the lines whitout bleeding the MC FIRST. Hook up all the lines real loose .Bleed a line at the MC. Yea you will loose a little fluid, then bleed the others.
As far as no fluid out the back lines. I think you are totally f**ked sounds like you have air everywhere including the accum and pump passage and you should start from square one by bleeding the MC first until you have clear fluid coming out of it. Not just the lines but the bleeder valves also.
When doing the brake line bleeding at the wheels have the key on.
Damn I hate to hear of this again. :icon_sad:
Couldn't I bleed the master cylinder from the bleeders on the sides of the master cylinder? Are those bleeders on the sides of the master cylinder? correct me if I'm wrong. Thanks for the help, I appreciate it!
Yes that where you do it. Just make sure you close the bleeders and put your fingers over the brake line holes upon pedal return. When you think you have the MC cleared run a good stream out of the break line holes. Don't forget the fingers on the holes.
Good luck.
Jud
Alright sweet. After I have the master cylinder good and bled, I just bleed the brakes like normal then? - my rear brakes don't work AT ALL. When I tried to bleed them before, NO FLUID OR AIR came out of BOTH rear caliper bleeders. The fronts bled fine though? Any suggestions?
Thanks much!
Quote from: TGP Nick on December 10, 2006, 08:06:27 PM
Alright sweet. After I have the master cylinder good and bled, I just bleed the brakes like normal then? - my rear brakes don't work AT ALL. When I tried to bleed them before, NO FLUID OR AIR came out of BOTH rear caliper bleeders. The fronts bled fine though? Any suggestions?
Thanks much!
Make sure the PMI pump has run and shut off. Leave key on. Can't remember if you have to run the motor. Been awhile. If that doesn't work bleed at the portioning valve toward the PMI. Have you bled the brake lines at the PMI?
Jud
Okay when I bled the brakes the first time, I had the ignition off, keys out of the car. I have NOT bled the brake lines at the master cylinder. Where is the proportioning valve?
Without the pump running you may not have enough pressure on the syustem to get through the proportioning valve.
Turn the key on and don't depress the pedal till you get a rear bleeder valve open. Really takes two people.
The valve is buy the fuel filter in front of the left rear tire.
Jud
Great! I thought that was the proportioning valve, but wasn't sure. Thanks for clearing that up! I'll have my friend help me do that tomorrow.
Thanks ;)
Nick
Nick how have you bled the rest of the system. It takes two people unless you have a hose from the bleeder valves into a jar full of fluid. You can't just open a bleeder and push the pedal and then go close the bleeder. The return of the pedal will pull air into the system.
Just checking.
You can put a 2x4 on the brake pedal with the other end aginst the seat and use the power seat to apply the pedal. Neat trick when you don't have help. ;)
Jud
Oh I see where u got that lol.-my bad! I had a friend help me bleed the brakes today. Otherwise we bled the system normally (we didn't bleed the master cylinder or proportioning valve though.) Bled from right rear (didn't work), left rear (didn't work), right front, left front. So yes a friend and I will be re-bleeding the whole brake system tomorrow. Hopefully it will stay semi-warm out for 1 more day!
Thanks
Nick
Quote from: TGP Nick on December 10, 2006, 08:29:16 PM
Okay when I bled the brakes the first time, I had the ignition off, keys out of the car. I have NOT bled the brake lines at the master cylinder. Where is the proportioning valve?
Turn the key on, and then bleed the rears.
The PMIII bleed procedure is outlined on Chris A.'s webpage for future reference. ;)
http://www.tpsgarage.com/
Quote from: mfewtrail on December 11, 2006, 12:47:34 AM
Quote from: TGP Nick on December 10, 2006, 08:29:16 PM
Okay when I bled the brakes the first time, I had the ignition off, keys out of the car. I have NOT bled the brake lines at the master cylinder. Where is the proportioning valve?
Turn the key on, and then bleed the rears.
The PMIII bleed procedure is outlined on Chris A.'s webpage for future reference. ;)
http://www.tpsgarage.com/
That's the procedure I used. ;)
Alright I was bleeding the brakes yesterday- was going good, until my battery died, due to my taillights being stuck on after replacing the PMIII. :icon_rolleyes: Needless to say, it is sitting in my garage getting the battery charged. I pulled my brakelight fuse, so it shouldn't drain the battery this time. :laugh: Does anybody have a procedure for adjusting the stoplamp switch? I'll have to do that sometime here. :icon_rolleyes:
the stop lamp switch set can be tricky, at least I find it to be. I have found that I really cannot pull back on the brake petal at all or else it will screw up the calibration and the lights will stay on.. but anyway..
Remove the under dash panel if you havent already, that will expose the switch. On the top of it is a metal tab that needs to be pulled down, best to take a metal clothes hanger and make a loop. From what I understand, and this may not be correct so you should still seek out other opinions, you need to push the pedal down while that tab is pulled. It can be tricky to get it right so plan on being in that uncomfortable position for a while.
Seats back, drop the column from the dash via the two bolts that hold it up. That should give sufficient access to the switch. Good luck.
I have to drop the steering column to adjust the switch?? Jeez... :icon_rolleyes:
Quote from: R Dubya on December 12, 2006, 08:06:06 PM
the stop lamp switch set can be tricky, at least I find it to be. I have found that I really cannot pull back on the brake petal at all or else it will screw up the calibration and the lights will stay on.. but anyway..
Remove the under dash panel if you havent already, that will expose the switch. On the top of it is a metal tab that needs to be pulled down, best to take a metal clothes hanger and make a loop. From what I understand, and this may not be correct so you should still seek out other opinions, you need to push the pedal down while that tab is pulled. It can be tricky to get it right so plan on being in that uncomfortable position for a while.
Seats back, drop the column from the dash via the two bolts that hold it up. That should give sufficient access to the switch. Good luck.
Are there any other ways of adjusting the switch? If not, can someone verify that the above is correct?
Thanks
Ryan kinda hit it on the head. I was able to do it without droping the wheel but seems like it would give you more room.
It's been about 4 years but as I remember you pull the wire toward the fire wall with the brake depresssed as far as you can. When you pull the wire you should hear a click. Release the pedal slowly and I believe you will here a rachet sound. That means you got it.
I tried mine a dozen times with no results. I finally took the switch out and a flat spring fell out. Installed new switch.
You are haveing a time aren't you. Hang in there you will get it.
Jud
Quote from: sleeperred90tgp on December 12, 2006, 08:47:25 PM
Ryan kinda hit it on the head. I was able to do it without droping the wheel but seems like it would give you more room.
It's been about 4 years but as I remember you pull the wire toward the fire wall with the brake depresssed as far as you can. When you pull the wire you should hear a click. Release the pedal slowly and I believe you will here a rachet sound. That means you got it.
I tried mine a dozen times with no results. I finally took the switch out and a flat spring fell out. Installed new switch.
You are haveing a time aren't you. Hang in there you will get it.
Jud
Alright thanks man. Yeah I'm having quite a time here lol. :willy_nilly: I'm NOWHERE NEAR giving up, though! The more I work on it and get it working better, the more "addicted" I guess I would call it I get to this car. I love my TGP! :-*
i think i did a brief write up on the brake light switch on w-body.. i might've deleted the image off my server but the description should still kinda make sense.
Hopefully I'll be re-bleeding the brakes today and getting them all sorted out. I'll keep ya guys posted. ;)
If I have to do it again, I mean when I have to do it again, :icon_rolleyes: I will remove the driver seat(4 quick bolts) like Jeff M does it and lay down there instead of trying to fold like a pretzel. My friend Colby can adjust it by pulling it but to me its all ass backwards so I just take the switch in and out. anymore, I just pay him to do it.
Okay which one is the switch- the gray one with the green button sticking out of it or the white thing?
its the white flimsy awkward looking thing clipped to the brakepedal pivot. has 2 wiring harnesses.
OK good. Hopefully get that adjusted today, too. -hopefully lol :laugh:
alright, not trying to jinx you but its probably fried if it killed your battery. unless you have LED taillights.
if it is impossible to get the lights off after adjustment. then that means the switch contact got hot and melted the plastic.
its designed to run that much current for only a minute or two max. incandescent bulbs suck power, imagine 6 or 8 of them on 1 skinny wire running all the way back to the trunk. combine that with a poor battery ground and it equals 1 fried switch.
switches are still readily available from the GM warehouses all throughout the country when I got one last year. Once you do it a couple of times its not such a task. Basically you are trying to position the brake pedal high enough on the switches moving arm so that when the pedal comes back down it opens the circuit and kills the lights. They can be reset and it may work, but chances are that when you removed the MC it screwed up the calibration and now they stay on.
When I said drop the column I didnt mean remove it. There are only two bolts that hold it to the dash panel, and it makes it a hell of a lot easier to get your arms up in there. I have skinny arms too. Its cramped. Expect a back ache. :icon_mrgreen:
Quote from: GangstGP on December 13, 2006, 02:02:50 PM
alright, not trying to jinx you but its probably fried if it killed your battery. unless you have LED taillights.
if it is impossible to get the lights off after adjustment. then that means the switch contact got hot and melted the plastic.
its designed to run that much current for only a minute or two max. incandescent bulbs suck power, imagine 6 or 8 of them on 1 skinny wire running all the way back to the trunk. combine that with a poor battery ground and it equals 1 fried switch.
No I have a shitty battery. I have had to charge it at least every 3-4 weeks since I bought the car. :icon_rolleyes: I've killed the battery a couple times just vacuuming the carpet, cleaning, just having the door open for 1/2 to 1 hour- So yeah battery is due for a replacement sometime here.
Well I'll try to adjust the switch anyway, see what happens I guess.
I tried to bleed the brakes again today with no success.
I opened the bleeder on one of my rear calipers, nothing came out.
I opened each bleeder from the master cylinder, even REMOVED them, NOTHING CAME OUT!!
And the biggest thing going on was that my pump didn't run AT ALL TODAY.
So I have some new problems. :icon_rolleyes: What would make my pump not run? It ran yesterday. :dunno:
Jeff, did you have any problems with this PMIII when it was in your TGP?
please tell me you had someone pump the brake hold it down and then you opened the bleeder???
YES I had a friend hold the brake pedal down while I opened the bleeders.
I know this may come across as a derogatory question, but have you checked the fluid? There are two compartments in the MC, one for the rear brakes and one for the fronts.
Nick your patience and commitment is amazing with this car!! many others would have washed their hands of it already
good for you!!
Hmm if the pumps not turning on, its possible that the pressure switch isnt telling the pump to turn on? Or that the pump in it isnt plugged in or defective.
Quote from: R Dubya on December 13, 2006, 05:40:39 PM
I know this may come across as a derogatory question, but have you checked the fluid? There are two compartments in the MC, one for the rear brakes and one for the fronts.
Yes I have checked and topped off the fluid very frequently while bleeding the brakes.
Quote from: Invasion1 on December 13, 2006, 05:49:21 PM
Nick your patience and commitment is amazing with this car!! many others would have washed their hands of it already
good for you!!
Thanks man! I would also like to thank everyone for their time and input- it has really helped me out and it is greatly appreciated! :thumb:
Quote from: Prospeeder on December 13, 2006, 06:45:14 PM
Hmm if the pumps not turning on, its possible that the pressure switch isnt telling the pump to turn on? Or that the pump in it isnt plugged in or defective.
Well what I am curious to know is why the pump would suddenly stop working like this. When I was bleeding the brakes yesterday and the battery died, the pump was working great. Today, the pump NEVER turned on, no matter how many times I pushed the brake pedal, or what bleeder I opened. Any other ideas?
Thanks much
Nick
Hey if Jeff (Kuntzie) is around, it would be nice if he chimed in, maybe he would know something about this. He sold me the PMIII that I just put in my TGP.
I'd appreciate the input!
Nick, man, if my car is running good here in the next few days and you want some help, maybe I'll come up there. I have no idea what to do, but it'll be a learning experience!
Quote from: TGP Nick on December 13, 2006, 06:56:04 PM
Quote from: R Dubya on December 13, 2006, 05:40:39 PM
I know this may come across as a derogatory question, but have you checked the fluid? There are two compartments in the MC, one for the rear brakes and one for the fronts.
Yes I have checked and topped off the fluid very frequently while bleeding the brakes.
Quote from: Invasion1 on December 13, 2006, 05:49:21 PM
Nick your patience and commitment is amazing with this car!! many others would have washed their hands of it already
good for you!!
Thanks man! I would also like to thank everyone for their time and input- it has really helped me out and it is greatly appreciated! :thumb:
Quote from: Prospeeder on December 13, 2006, 06:45:14 PM
Hmm if the pumps not turning on, its possible that the pressure switch isnt telling the pump to turn on? Or that the pump in it isnt plugged in or defective.
Well what I am curious to know is why the pump would suddenly stop working like this. When I was bleeding the brakes yesterday and the battery died, the pump was working great. Today, the pump NEVER turned on, no matter how many times I pushed the brake pedal, or what bleeder I opened. Any other ideas?
Thanks much
Nick
This was me all summer. working trying to make the best of two PMIII units. took it in and out like 6 or 7 times and switched pumps and accumulaters. bought a new pressure switch and installed it. net result: one leaking piece of crap. the pump works, pressure switch works, slight 1/2 sec. delay and it leaks a little too much out of the weep hole in the plunger housing. If I decide to get a Prior unit I'll give you my good working pump motor and you can bolt it on yours.
Quote from: GangstGP on December 13, 2006, 08:06:23 PM
Quote from: TGP Nick on December 13, 2006, 06:56:04 PM
Quote from: R Dubya on December 13, 2006, 05:40:39 PM
I know this may come across as a derogatory question, but have you checked the fluid? There are two compartments in the MC, one for the rear brakes and one for the fronts.
Yes I have checked and topped off the fluid very frequently while bleeding the brakes.
Quote from: Invasion1 on December 13, 2006, 05:49:21 PM
Nick your patience and commitment is amazing with this car!! many others would have washed their hands of it already
good for you!!
Thanks man! I would also like to thank everyone for their time and input- it has really helped me out and it is greatly appreciated! :thumb:
Quote from: Prospeeder on December 13, 2006, 06:45:14 PM
Hmm if the pumps not turning on, its possible that the pressure switch isnt telling the pump to turn on? Or that the pump in it isnt plugged in or defective.
Well what I am curious to know is why the pump would suddenly stop working like this. When I was bleeding the brakes yesterday and the battery died, the pump was working great. Today, the pump NEVER turned on, no matter how many times I pushed the brake pedal, or what bleeder I opened. Any other ideas?
Thanks much
Nick
This was me all summer. working trying to make the best of two PMIII units. took it in and out like 6 or 7 times and switched pumps and accumulaters. bought a new pressure switch and installed it. net result: one leaking piece of crap. the pump works, pressure switch works, slight 1/2 sec. delay and it leaks a little too much out of the weep hole in the plunger housing. If I decide to get a Prior unit I'll give you my good working pump motor and you can bolt it on yours.
That'd be cool man! The thing is that I just bought this PMIII- is is a barely used Prior Reman unit from Kuntzie. Could this sudden pump death be caused by the relay going out? Any input would be great!
Thanks
Nick
Quote from: TGP Nick on December 13, 2006, 08:14:10 PM
Quote from: GangstGP on December 13, 2006, 08:06:23 PM
Quote from: TGP Nick on December 13, 2006, 06:56:04 PM
Quote from: R Dubya on December 13, 2006, 05:40:39 PM
I know this may come across as a derogatory question, but have you checked the fluid? There are two compartments in the MC, one for the rear brakes and one for the fronts.
Yes I have checked and topped off the fluid very frequently while bleeding the brakes.
Quote from: Invasion1 on December 13, 2006, 05:49:21 PM
Nick your patience and commitment is amazing with this car!! many others would have washed their hands of it already
good for you!!
Thanks man! I would also like to thank everyone for their time and input- it has really helped me out and it is greatly appreciated! :thumb:
Quote from: Prospeeder on December 13, 2006, 06:45:14 PM
Hmm if the pumps not turning on, its possible that the pressure switch isnt telling the pump to turn on? Or that the pump in it isnt plugged in or defective.
Well what I am curious to know is why the pump would suddenly stop working like this. When I was bleeding the brakes yesterday and the battery died, the pump was working great. Today, the pump NEVER turned on, no matter how many times I pushed the brake pedal, or what bleeder I opened. Any other ideas?
Thanks much
Nick
This was me all summer. working trying to make the best of two PMIII units. took it in and out like 6 or 7 times and switched pumps and accumulaters. bought a new pressure switch and installed it. net result: one leaking piece of crap. the pump works, pressure switch works, slight 1/2 sec. delay and it leaks a little too much out of the weep hole in the plunger housing. If I decide to get a Prior unit I'll give you my good working pump motor and you can bolt it on yours.
That'd be cool man! The thing is that I just bought this PMIII- is is a barely used Prior Reman unit from Kuntzie. Could this sudden pump death be caused by the relay going out? Any input would be great!
Thanks
Nick
I dunno man i just figured we needed more quotes :icon_razz:
lol sorry bout that! :laugh:
well, its possible the relay has gone bad, or the pressure switch has in some way become in operative, or has a broken wire somehow, if theres no enough power the pump cant turn on either, so make sure the battery is good and charged
I drove my car for 20 days this summer when I first fired it up and the fluid kept leaking and the motor went dry. thats when they fry. now I keep filling it up and its barely hangin in there. doubt its the pressure switch or the relay. I got a pressure switch and didnt help shit. just thought it was leaking but did UV dye and seen it drip right out the plunger weep hole. same place on both units so if anyone is reading and has a good top half with a fried pump motor, I want it.
Quote from: Prospeeder on December 13, 2006, 10:33:46 PM
well, its possible the relay has gone bad, or the pressure switch has in some way become in operative, or has a broken wire somehow, if theres no enough power the pump cant turn on either, so make sure the battery is good and charged
I tried to get the pump to run after I charged the battery overnight, no pump run. I put the battery chearger on and tried it also. No luck.
Nick, I would start at the beginning to get your pump running or prove it's broken. There are 4 or 5 fuses and at least 3 relays on this system. The pump is goverened by a 30 amp fuse in the electrical box beside your washer bottle. I would start there. Ohm the fuse, there sometimes hard to see if there blown. If good check the voltage with key on at the fuse socket. If you have power there try swapping a fuse from the electric center by the rt fender. I think one of the cooling fans is 30 amps. Check all the other fuses including the one in the glove box.
If that all checks out ok then we will go to the relay on the side of the PM and see if there is something wrong there. That relay can be tested along with the power in and power out and the pressure switch can be bypassed.
Try the fuse and let me know.
Jud
I don't have an OHM meter/tester. I think when I get home today I'll just try swapping the relay from my old PMIII and see if that will let the pump turn on. If not, I dunno...
the fuse has a clear window on top of it, you should be able to see that one pink fuse for the pump motor easy. 30 amp one. I think they're slow-blow fuses, cost like $2.50 each. so get em from the J/Y. bet thats all it is. If it keeps blowing the fuse the pumps going out. keep an eye on it when the system primes itself when you first hit the key.
Quote from: GangstGP on December 14, 2006, 12:04:35 PM
the fuse has a clear window on top of it, you should be able to see that one pink fuse for the pump motor easy. 30 amp one. I think they're slow-blow fuses, cost like $2.50 each. so get em from the J/Y. bet thats all it is. If it keeps blowing the fuse the pumps going out. keep an eye on it when the system primes itself when you first hit the key.
Ok I'll check those fuses also.
oh wait, I guess Jud covered that already :icon_redface: yea, what Jud said. :icon_cool:
Quote from: GangstGP on December 14, 2006, 02:52:30 PM
oh wait, I guess Jud covered that already :icon_redface: yea, what Jud said. :icon_cool:
Ha, yea I thought I heard an echo. :laugh:
Jud
I checked ALL of the fuses that are brake related, NONE are blown, I even swapped the 30 amp one out like you said, Jud. The only thing fuse/relay I haven't swapped out is the relay ON the PMIII. Pump still refuses to run.
I just replaced the relay that is mounted on the side of the PMIII with a known good relay off my other PMIII, and the pump still refuses to run. :icon_rolleyes:
What should I do next?
What should I do next? Any ideas?
Thanks everyone
<------------------------Glad I blew up the engine and not reparing PMIII Brakes :icon_eek:
I would take the unit out (maybe do it while its in?) hot wire the positive and negative and see if the pump will run.
try the other one too. touch the wires with a power drill battery or something. thats how I test window motors in the junkyard.
Hotwire it? HOW?? I need an explanation.
Why don't you try the pressure swich out of the the PM you got the relay from. You can see if the pump will run by applying 12v to the white wire on the relay plug. Hope you didn't put the relay back on the pump.
My neighbor just had an idea- maybe the system is SO pressurized and full of air, the system thinks there is enough pressure that the pump doesn't need to run. I'm gonna pull the brake lines out of the master cylinder like you said and see if anything comes out.
take your PMIII you took out and hook up the power drill battery just like I said. the pump should run momentarily while you brush some hot wires across the terminals of the plug. If it dont run then the pump dont work. its just to verify that the pump is fried and its not something else
what Jud said :laugh:
Alright I got the pump running by my neighbor's idea: I unplugged the 2 BIG wire couplers up by the battery and unplugged the battery for 30 seconds. After 30 seconds, I plugged everything back in previously removed, turned the key and low and behold the pump turned on! In order to get the fluid going, I pulled each brake line out of the master cylinder one at a time until fluid came out, then put the brake lines back in.
Next, I pulled the brake line going IN to the rear proportioning valve until fluid came out of that, while my friend stepped on the brake pedal. Then I tightened the brake line back up. (I pulled the line, because I couldn't get the bleeder on the prop valve to come loose.)
Needless to say, the pump runs now and the brakes work better, but not great. I will be doing a full bleeding at each wheel tomorrow.
The only thing now is: BOTH my BRAKE and ANTILOCK lights are on. How do I find out why the lights are on? Do I need a brake code reader?
Thanks for the help everyone, you guys helped me eliminate a LOT of possible things that could've gone wrong!
Thanks much ;)
Nick
:cheers: :cheers: :gr_grin: :gr_grin: :werd: :dunno:
unplug the batter for about a min the plug it back in.. if the light stay on then something is still wrong if not then ur good
Quote from: kuntzie on December 16, 2006, 07:54:20 PM
unplug the batter for about a min the plug it back in.. if the light stay on then something is still wrong if not then ur good
I just went and did that. Both of the lights are on steady. Just to be sure, I checked the PMIII: from fully discharged (40 pumps of the brake) it took ~45 seconds for the pump to stop running, so that is good. And the pump runs every 3 presses of the brake pedal, so that is good also.
What could be going wrong now? Do I need a brake code reader to figure this out?
Thanks
no code reader is necessary. The red light on all the time is due to the fluid possible being low, that should go away when the level is proper and the system is also bled correctly. Solid antilock light means that the anti lock function is not working at all, when it blinks its indicating a problem. That switch under the dash is most likely the culprit unless you have already calibrated it. Once its all bled proper I would expect those lights go off, as you are getting 3 presses per charge from the pump. Bleed it first before you start to worry.
UPDATE: I bled the brakes today until fresh, clean fluid came out at each caliper. THE GOOD: After bleeding the brakes, I went out and drove it- all I can say is WOW the brakes have never worked this well! They are UNBELIEVEABLY powerful and the car stops VERY quickly. THE BAD: Both my BRAKE light and my ANTILOCK light are on steady. When I drove it, I took it on a short 50 foot gravel driveway to see how it would stop on loose surfaces, I found out my antilock brakes don't work! The car just skids! :laugh: I got a kick outta it anyway lol.
So, I'm thinkin that I maybe have a wheel speed sensor out, since antilock isn't working and both of my lights are on steady? What do you guys think?
Anyway I'm happy that all of my brakes are now working and are more powerful than ever! :icon_twisted:
Thanks everyone!
Quote from: R Dubya on December 17, 2006, 07:22:06 AM
no code reader is necessary.
How do I find out why the lights are on then? I'm thinkin wheel speed sensor since my ABS isn't working. But how do I find out what is wrong?
Nick, I have a steady BRAKE and Anti-lock light on all the time...along with LOW COOLANT, even though it's full...these lights are PITA's...I also have a driver's side wheel speed sensor that has been replaced 3 times by the previous owner, and it's out now; he says thats why my ANTI-LOCK light is always on...the BRAKE light, if I'm not mistaken, and correct me if I'm wrong, is just for the emergency brake...check and see if it's slightly pressed down.
I disconnected my Ebrake cable from my rear calipers. (The Ebrake cable is stuck in the ebrake on position, so both rear wheels were locked up- that's why I disconnected it.) Maybe that's why the BRAKE light is on huh? But the antilock function of my brakes isn't working as posted above- what else could be wrong, and how do I find out what the brake codes are?
Thanks
You DO need a code reader for the ABS, i belive it has to be a special one too, go to a shop and see if anyone has a reader for old GM ABS brakes, lucklily my autoshop at school has one. If the abs isnt working, its not getting a wheel speed sensor reading, one of the selenoids arnt engauging correctly, or somthing of that nature. Push your foot firmly on the pedal, and turn the ignition to on, u hear the selenoids click, does the pedal drop really far? it shouldnt drop much at all.
do you have the switch calibrated? I guess I assumed it would solve the issue once bled and working properly. I guess its time to hook it up to a computer, I didn't mean to say you didn't need it. If the antilock light is steady that means that the system is disabled, if it blinks it still works just an issue with pressure or something.
Alright I guess I'll have to find someone with a code reader :icon_rolleyes: Sounds to me like a wheel speed sensor though.
Before I replaced the PMIII, the BRAKE light was on all the time, while the ANTILOCK light flashed (low accumulator charge), now it has a good PMIII with a new accumulator - both lights are on steady and the antilock function no longer works- it did work a month ago. The car sat for a month before I put the new PMIII in it too. Anyway my mission right now is to find someone with a code reader.
Thanks for your input, everyone. ;)
Nick
This is kinda topic related/kinda not. I need an anti-theft wheel locknut remover. My TGP didn't come with one, and I imagine that I will have to take the wheels off soon if I do indeed have to replace my wheel speed sensor. Does anybody have one around?
Thanks
They're not all the same. I would try going to the dealer and seeing if they can get a lug key matched from your VIN.. good luck with that though.
Alright I'll have to run to the dealer then.
thanks
Nick
If you need to Just size it up to a metric or standard socket, one thats a little tight. Tap it on there far enough to get a good grip and see if you can break it loose. I think the dealer will hit you for at least $25 if you go. I've taken mine off totally. No one wants gold lace wheels. :laugh:
Quote from: R Dubya on December 18, 2006, 09:06:24 PM
If you need to Just size it up to a metric or standard socket, one thats a little tight. Tap it on there far enough to get a good grip and see if you can break it loose. I think the dealer will hit you for at least $25 if you go. I've taken mine off totally. No one wants gold lace wheels. :laugh:
Alright I'll try that then. :laugh:
i just took a punch and put the socket in the table vice, then tapped it out after. good luck.
Good idea. I'll try that- save me a good $25 anyway. :laugh:
I doubt anybody has this, but does anybody have the part # for a Ebrake cable? I need one that goes from the pedal to the rear calipers- mine is shot.
thanks
are you sure it is dead? sometimes those things just hang up because there is too much gunk in there and keeps if from ratcheting down. If the cable is snapped then yeah, you have to replace, dealer only item, but if its not snapped just try cleaning that mechanism and you might find it will make it work.
My cable is all nasty and stuck- like corroded from the inside- so much that the parking brake is stuck on. I disconnected it because I couldn't get the cable to budge. :icon_rolleyes: :laugh:
I don't know how you feel about aftermaket items but I got mine at the local Advanced Auto store. Mine was so rusted that I had to use sawzall to get the bitch off. Let me add one more thing, I'm not a mechanic but there must be a easier way to put the new one on. I went ahead and installed it after I put the parking brake assembly back on, and to get that eye hook latched, was literly and SOB.
How much did it cost? I NEED a new cable!
I couldn't have spent over $30 OH wait my wife just said I spent 27.99 plus tax, so what ever that is. :icon_wink:
Wow that's not bad at all! Do you happen to have the part # and brand of the cable?
Thanks man!
Nick
Anybody got the part # for the cable?
http://www.partsamerica.com/ProductList.aspx?PartType=686&PTSet=A&SearchFor=Brake%20Cable
try stopping into the store and having them look it up, that was if its wrong they are liable and not you.
Are there TWO Ebrake cables? It lists one cable for left rear and one for right rear on every site I try.
Part number is C93581 it was $15.88 and the name who made the product was Tru-Torque
Sweet! Thanks man! Was that one cable, or is there two?
thanks again
Nick
Ok I ordered the cables this morning at Checker, and they should be in the store this afternoon. But, there are TWO cables for the parking brake according to checker and all the websites I've looked at. So, I ordered both cables. Is this correct? Are there two cables?
Thanks
We'll I just got off the phone with Advanced Auto and they gave me part # for everything, here it goes. Rear right is c93596 , rear left is c93864 and the front cable is c93581 and thats the one that goes through the floor board to your parking brake mechanism. And I'll let you know also, hooking that B*tch underneath was HELL better have a good pair of vice grips, unless you know a better way let me in on it
Alright I ordered a BC93581 and a BC93596. So there are THREE cables? I need to know asap, because I'm going back to Checker tomorrow.
there is an adjustable parking brake equalizer underneath of there as well, thats what tensions the two rear/side cables. It all depends on what you need to replace under there. Make sure that if you order something and don't need it you can return it. Check on that equalizer as well it may need replacing.
Ok, I'm gonna order the BC93864 cable tomorrow. Would you happen to have the part # for the equalizer? I can't find this equalizer anywhere, only cables. :icon_confused:
Thanks
If anybody has the part # for the equalizer, let me know asap- I need to run to checker tomorrow before everything closes for X-mas. :icon_rolleyes:
Thanks
I don't have it, you may have to wait until after christmas unless someone jumps in.
Jimmy- when you replaced your e-brake cables, did you replace the equalizer also?
I did not have to change that, luckily it was still in pretty good condition, why is yours not looking so good? I'll see first thing in the morning if I can find this part # for you.
Mine doesn't APPEAR to be in bad shape, but I figure if it isn't to expensive, I might as well replace it with the others.
Thanks much!
If you can't get the part # or if it is really expensive, I'll prolly just use the one I have. I'm just hoping that IT isn't seized up also! :icon_rolleyes:
I ordered the other cable (BC93864) this morning, and I will be picking all of the cables up on Tuesday.
I'm just gonna take the equalizer I have now, clean it up and lube it up good with some silicone spray. If I can't make it work, I can just run back and get a new one.
So Santa Claus, The Easter Bunny, and a TGP the runs perfectly and will never need any work done to it are all running after a hundred dollar bill...who gets it first? Answer? NONE! None of them exist lol! But, in the Christmas spirit, I'll pray for a Christmas miracle that will get your brakes working right, Nick!
Thanks man ;) Won't be long before I get everything working right!
I will be fixing my brakes for good hopefully this week. I'm going to pick up my E-brake cables tomorrow, then install them very soon. I will be getting the ABS codes read also, to see what is really wrong. I'm suspecting a wheel speed sensor at this point- which brings me to my question: When replacing my wheel speed sensor(s), would it be any better/worse/make any difference (other than price) whether I got wheel speed sensors USED outta my local J/Y, or if I got NEW sensor(s) from the dealership?
Nick
For the price you can't beat the junkyard. While you're there you might want to grap a harness.These type of sensors are usually pretty reliable. Problem might be the wiring or a bad connection instead. First step is finding out which wheel(s). Good luck Nick.
Alright thanks man. ;) My mission today is to find someone with a code reader, whether it is any of my neighbors, or if not, I'll go to the stealership. :laugh: I'll keep you guys posted.
Thanks
Nick
None of my neighbors had code readers, so I will be going to the stealership tomorrow to find out what is wrong with the ABS. :icon_rolleyes:
Kyle you have a PM. :icon_cool:
Quote from: TGP Nick on December 26, 2006, 11:53:08 AM
None of my neighbors had code readers, so I will be going to the stealership tomorrow to find out what is wrong with the ABS. :icon_rolleyes:
Kyle you have a PM. :icon_cool:
Me????
No, Grinders 18- that Kyle. :laugh: Sorry bout that!
Quote from: TGP Nick on December 26, 2006, 01:21:36 PM
No, Grinders 18- that Kyle. :laugh: Sorry bout that!
haha no worries. Didn't know how Reading your codes related to me and the Topgun Chip! LOL.
what sucks is it takes a special reader to get ABS codes and diagnostics. Also whats nice is the dealers charge you over an hours worth of labor just to do it
Unfortunately, the dealer is the only person/place that has a code reader. :icon_evil: Hopefully it doesn't cost me an arm and a leg to get done! On the plus side, my brake issues will be over soon. I'm taking it in tomorrow morning.
Nick, do you have any community/technical colleges in the area that have an automotive program? If so, they should be able to read the code(s) for you.
Quote from: mfewtrail on December 26, 2006, 06:54:24 PM
Nick, do you have any community/technical colleges in the area that have an automotive program? If so, they should be able to read the code(s) for you.
Not that I know of. Good idea though. ;)
I picked up my parking brake cables today. I should be putting them on very soon. Car is now going into the shop on Friday morning.
I picked up my TGP from the dealership just now- they took a look at the brakes, and probably put the brake scan tool on there and cleared the codes. Whatever they did- the brakes work PERFECT now! The ANTILOCK light was off when I picked it up, and stayed off the whole time I drove it. I drove it about 30 miles, a mix of 70 MPH highway driving, in town driving, and on some country roads where I tested the brakes- Antilock now works! It stops VERY quickly now, even on pure ice surfaces. (They don't salt out where I live). So I'm very happy that the brakes work great now. They charged me $120 for this and they checked over the car- the 100 point inspection thing or whatever its called. I had them take a look at my stop lamp switch, because I could NOT get my taillights to turn off- they said the switch is worn out/outta spec, and said it needed to be replaced. Guess how much they wanted to replace the stop lamp switch? 300 f**kin dollars! :icon_eek: So I didn't get that replaced. I swung by O'reilly on the way home and picked up a new stop lamp switch for $20, and the TGP goes into the other local shop tomorrow morning to get the new switch put in for $90. So I only have my BRAKE light on the dash now- I will be replacing my Ebrake cable soon, and that will turn that light off.
yea long story short, my brakes work great now! :icon_mrgreen:
When I finally got the whole brake system complete ,I also realize my brakes lights were on all the time . So my mechanic ask me if I reset them. We'll hell I did'nt know what f**k he was talking about, he then told me to take a coat hanger and pull on a small lever hook on to the Brake switch, and that cleared it :skep: :worshippy: :new_all_coholic:
Now ya tell me :icon_rolleyes: lol j/k ;)
I got my TGP back from the other dealership today- they installed my new stoplamp switch and my taillights now work perfectly too! I'm almost done with my big brake project, all I have to do now is replace my parking brake cable. That SHOULD turn off my BRAKE light on my dash. ANTILOCK light is staying off and my brakes are still working perfectly. :icon_mrgreen:
OWES NOES ITS BACK!!! :laugh:
I'm having brake problems again. :laugh: For the past week, my ANTILOCK light has come on and done some wierd things.... on Monday, the light came on and stayed on for the whole time I drove the car. Tuesday- I drove it and the light FLASHED the whole time I drove the car. Wednesday- the light never came on... Thursday: the light flashed for the first 5 minutes I drove the car, then it just turned on solid for the rest of the day... When the light was on solid today, I did a very fast stop on a dirt backroad and looked at my front wheel when I floored the brakes- the wheel just locks up and skids!!! I've checked my aux. terminal and that is tight. What could be causing the light to turn on and the ABS not to work?
Somebody help... WTF is wrong with my brakes now??? :laugh:
I have that problem somtimes, its rare for me, but somtimes my ABS light will just come on and my wheels will just lock up if i slam them on. Then the light just goes away, probably a faulty wheel speed sensor or its wiring. It never stored a code for it, my Auto shop had a GM code reader that did PM3 Diagnositic tests and operation checks, along with code reading.
Well today I charged my battery for 2 hours (my really shitty battery is getting weak). I started it up, and the ANTILOCK light was off! I drove it around for a while and did 4 HARD stops on a dirt backroad, and antilock is working again and the brakes are SUPER powerful now! I hope that solved the problem for good! Note to self... buy a new battery! :laugh:
Nick, I'm gonna start a Fund Raiser for you so we can get you a new battery lol!
Light is back on today GRRRRR.....
sounds like what my high mileage tgp does, I'm pretty sure its an intermittent leak somewhere in the pump housing. its an old unit and let's face it, they were not the greatest pieces of electronic braking that hit the market.
might be time to consider finding a replacement, or preparing to foot the large reman bill from Prior. When was the last time you replaced the brake switch under the dash?
I just replaced my PMIII with a new Prior Reman PMIII last fall, so it has MAYBE 1,000 miles on it... I highly doubt there is anything wrong with it.
The brake switch? If you mean the stop lamp switch, I had that replaced right after I put in my new PMIII.
Quote from: TGP Nick on June 04, 2007, 06:46:32 PM
I just replaced my PMIII with a new Prior Reman PMIII last fall, so it has MAYBE 1,000 miles on it... I highly doubt there is anything wrong with it.
The brake switch? If you mean the stop lamp switch, I had that replaced right after I put in my new PMIII.
What about the individual ABS wheel sensors?
I haven't done anything to the ABS wheel sensors. After I put in my PMIII, I brought the car to the dealer and had them put in a new stop lamp switch, while it was there, I had them check and see why my ANTILOCK light was on.... they scanned it for codes and tightened the aux. positive terminal, and must have cleared the codes, because the light has stayed off this whole year, up until the last week... and yes, I have tightened my terminal again, so that isn't the problem.
ABS light is on steady and disabled, it means theres a problem with the speed sensor(s) or possibly the solenoids that control the Fluid acuation for the abs. Sounds like u need the code read.
Nick, not for me to be a told-you-so-er, but that's the one thing I had suggested lol. I hate rubbing stuff in, but I'm rarely right!
Strange as it sounds, I think this MAY be caused by my battery.... it is INCREDIBLY sucky! It is bad to the point that the battery dies every day, whether I drive the car or not. The light doesn't come on right away if I give the battery a full charge (2 hours) but it seems when the battery starts to get drained, all of my accessories start to suck... when it is low: the radio sucks, all my lights are dimmer then when the battery is fully charged, and when the battery gets low, something whines under the hood... because of the low battery, could it be possible that it is disabling ABS to save energy? I don't know... just a guess. Luckily yesterday was my last day of school, so I don't need to drive it anywhere for a long time.... I will replace the battery when I get a chance. If it isn't the battery, then I'll move on to getting the codes read and replacing the wheel speed sensors if they are bad.
I believe there's a possiblity it could be your battery too. A charged battery is a nice thing to have. Replace it and find out.
Also check / clean your grounds and other connections. I had an XM sky-fi unit that was very sensitive to under-voltage. It would loose the signal if you were at a stop light for more than a few seconds. Replaced the alternator in my truck and it was a little better. After further investigation I found a bad connection under the hood.
If you've got a bad battery already I would start there.
You can always check the voltage at the ABS module and compare it to a new / fresh battery to test.
This could just be the battery.
If your battery dies everyday, it is time to replace.
I replaced my battery today! :laugh: $32 with exchange of the cruddy old battery.
My Antilock now works just fine, but now my ANTILOCK light is flashing. I checked how many pumps it took to turn the pump on, and it runs at every pump, which is strange, because about two weeks ago it took 4 presses of the pedal before the pump ran... could my accumulator have already died?!?!
Well I think I may have found what is wrong with my brakes- I looked underneath the car today and noticed that the aluminum proportioning valve next to the fuel filter was soaked in brake fluid. I'm thinkin it probably is cracked somewhere.... I have an extra proportioning valve sitting here, so I'll have to swap it in. Is this a pretty common problem?
as ugly as mine looks, it still seems to be holding up. I would have to say mine may possibly be a orginal. Nick I've never heard these just go bad.
Quote from: TGP Nick on June 19, 2007, 05:40:05 PM
Well I think I may have found what is wrong with my brakes- I looked underneath the car today and noticed that the aluminum proportioning valve next to the fuel filter was soaked in brake fluid. I'm thinkin it probably is cracked somewhere.... I have an extra proportioning valve sitting here, so I'll have to swap it in. Is this a pretty common problem?
Yep, one of the
other common brake problems. ;)
mines leaking, and no dealer can get me the part, they said its on back order :s
I went back and re-read this topic and realized that I never said how I fixed it. :laugh:
I replaced the proportioning valve with a spare I had and re-bled the brakes, and the brakes have been working perfectly since then. ;)