I'm looking to get the air conditioning working on my TGP for the summer. I was looking at FREEZE 12..... http://www.freeze12.com/
Is anyone familiar with this stuff? It seems pretty cool, and I wouldn't have to go through all the trouble of converting my AC to R134A or flushing the old R12- or whatever is left in the system out. Any input?
Thanks
I went with r134 3 or 4 years ago and all I changed was the orifice tube I did have it evacuated and recharged by a AC shop with the proper oil. The compressor is starting to rattle a little, but what can you expect after 17 years. :icon_sad:
Jud
Nick, Freeze 12 is pretty much 134a, so you're actually supposed to convert everything over like you would when converting to 134a. I can scan an excerpt from one of my automotive books that explains about Freeze 12 if you want. Despite, what I said above, I have seen a lot of people mix Freeze 12 with R-12 or use freeze 12 in an untouched R-12 system with no problems. I actually have a can or two of Freeze 12 kicking around in my closet. :laugh:
EDIT: "Freeze 12: A blend of 80 percent HFC-134a and 20 percent HCFC-142b--is acceptable for automotive use subject to having proper fittings, labeling, and a compressor shut-off switch. It is not a drop-in replacement for CFC-12(R12) or HFC-134a."
So no matter if I run Freeze 12 or R134A, then I still have to convert my system over, correct?
Quote from: TGP Nick on May 18, 2007, 11:31:47 AM
So no matter if I run Freeze 12 or R134A, then I still have to convert my system over, correct?
That's what is *suggested* There's honestly no set rule to follow on conversions. It is a good idea to at least replace the orifice tube before retrofitting to 134a. Most places will recommend replacing the accumulator with one that is 134a compatible along with flushing the system to remove as much mineral oil(134a uses PAG oil) as possible. If I were you, I would choose 134a. It works well and can be found at any parts store, target, k-mart, walmart, etc. Freeze 12 is not commonly available, at least not in my area(only one mom & pop type auto parts store here carries it).
When converting to R134 I would replace the accumulator as well as the oriface tube. I used a blue ford tube in Jimmy's Tgp when we converted his.(local shops do this to GM's when they convert Jimmy's works as well with R134 as it did with R12 with this tube here in Florida) Also I think it we used about 1.88 lb of R134.(the same amount a newer Lumina uses the A/C is set up very much the same as a TGP) Pag oil is used in R134 systems but is not compatible with mineral oil. Ester oil is compatible with both mineral and Pag. So use ester oil in your conversion.
Tim
Dont bother converting anything over. Its a complete waste of time for any 88+ gm. Just follow the instructions in the other section for tank replacement (for MUCH easier charging), Orifice if you want, I didnt. And my AC is colder than hell..
Quote from: pontiac6ksteawd on May 19, 2007, 12:21:36 AM
Dont bother converting anything over. Its a complete waste of time for any 88+ gm. Just follow the instructions in the other section for tank replacement (for MUCH easier charging), Orifice if you want, I didnt. And my AC is colder than hell..
Could you post a link to what you did?
Thanks
so you didn't use an orifice tube??
Nope. My compressor didnt make any noise when the system was dry and empty. So that tells me nothing got in there for the orifice to be clogged with. And so far so good. No leaks, cold AC, etc.
Quote from: pontiac6ksteawd on May 19, 2007, 12:21:36 AM
Dont bother converting anything over. Its a complete waste of time for any 88+ gm. Just follow the instructions in the other section for tank replacement (for MUCH easier charging), Orifice if you want, I didnt. And my AC is colder than hell..
Could you post a link to what you did?
Thanks
Quote from: TGP Nick on May 21, 2007, 02:27:58 PM
Quote from: pontiac6ksteawd on May 19, 2007, 12:21:36 AM
Dont bother converting anything over. Its a complete waste of time for any 88+ gm. Just follow the instructions in the other section for tank replacement (for MUCH easier charging), Orifice if you want, I didnt. And my AC is colder than hell..
Could you post a link to what you did?
Thanks
X2
this is interesting, I had been recommended to remove the orifice entirely as well, but didn't do it, but for some reason my A/C is not as cold as I would like it to be. I think it may need a little more refrigerant but I may end up removing that tube to see if it helps make it colder.
Quote from: R Dubya on May 21, 2007, 05:25:42 PM
this is interesting, I had been recommended to remove the orifice entirely as well, but didn't do it, but for some reason my A/C is not as cold as I would like it to be. I think it may need a little more refrigerant but I may end up removing that tube to see if it helps make it colder.
What exactly does the orifice tube do, and where is it located?
it acts as a filter and separator in the A/C system. I've been told many different opinions on whether or not it is necessary. That's all the info I have.
oh yeah location. It's located in the a/c line under the turbo. its a little plastic inline filter sort of thing. I may be removing mine so I will take a pic if I do. Maybe someone has one??
do not remove it. It is needed. It does have a screen on it but it is also a little tube hense the name oriface. The compressor takes the low pressure gas and compresses it. It is now a high pressure liquid coming out of the compressor. It runs through the condenser to be cooled. It comes out still in liquid form but cooler. it then gets to the ORIFACE tube where it is basicly metered to the low side through the tube and on to the evaporator. This changing of states from liquid to gas is what removes the heat from the air flowing over the evaporator. If you remove the tube the high side gas will just flow uncontrolled to the evaporator and NO cooling will happen. Also your high side gauge reading will drop and the low side will go high. These tubes have differant size openings for differant applications. That is why I said I used a ford blue tube in Jimmys TGP it is a differant size tube. I believe the stock TGP tube is white. Ask Jimmy how his car cooled after the R134 swap with the blue tube. (His isn't working right now because a steel line had a hole rubbed in it (behind the master cylinder) right before repairing his powermaster III and the 5sp swap we just need to charge it up)
Yea what he said, leave the orifice in. It is a required and esential part of the AC system..
As far as what I did, I had a bit more work on mine TGP cause it was previously totaled and wrecked in the front end. I did replace the AC Condensor, as well as the acumlator, and both lines coming off the AC compressor going to the acumalator tank, and condensor. I also replaced the condensor with a diferent model (can be found in the "How do I" section). Vacced it down at a shop, came home, put the fittings on, and converted the SOB to R134a. It leaked out over the first winter cause I accidently put to O-rings in on a connection.