So I am on the highway on the way to school today, cruisin at a nice 75 or so. I went to pass someone, stepped on it a bit, got up to about 85 as I was passing him, and stalled out. Popped it in neutral, started back up and kept goin. Didn't make a whole lot of sense to me, so I just kept goin thinkin it was a fluke. Later on I get up to a little over 80 and it starts hesitating, almost feeling as if the govorner was kicking in, then at about 85 it stalls again.....
possible issues maybe fuel pump/filter/injectors, in that order, is what I am thinking. That seem like the right place to start troubleshooting?
Maybe check the aux battery post?
That looked good and was all tight.
More problems on the way home. It stalled a few more times, and I was getting a lot of sputtering, and what sounded like a backfire. It was lobing kind of like there was vacuum problem maybe and did not want to idle for shit. It was all pretty random too, so hard to tell. I have a fuel filter layin around I bought a few years ago for my old 91 Prix that I never ended up replacing, so I am going to do that tomorrow and see if that helps any, cuz it's 90 out and I don't feel like messin with it at the moment.
Also I have no idea how long the car sat before I got it, but it also sat in my driveway for almost 4 months before I put it on the road, I did start it periodically and let it run a few min, it was damn near empty, so I put in some fuel treatment and filled it with super. It ran great all day yesterday, with some minor hesitation, I was thinking it might just be the computer learning, and there is some hard shifting, I gotta look into that a little bit. But right now my main concern is figuring out this stalling issue, so any help is greatly appreciated.
I am also going to get the engine scanned to see if it is putting out any codes, cuz the SES light did come on a couple times when I just had it idling.
no need to use a scan tool you can pull the codes with a paperclip. On the diagnostic connector underneath the drivers side of the dash you can take a paperclip, bend it in a U shape, and ground the two connections on the top right of the connector. Do this with the key in the on position, but with the car off. It will flash a code three times, I believe it's 13, so it will blink once, pause, then blink 3 times quickly. It will repeat this 3 times. Then it will flash error codes in the same way. For example, it may Blink 3 times, pause, blink 3 times, which is a code 33. It will also repeat 3 times.
Sounds like you may have a clogged cat, but it could be host of problems. I had to replace the ECM in my machine once when it was stalling at highway speeds, but it would almost be a guarantee it wouldn't start again. Lay down on the ground next time it does it and see if the converter is glowing.
ok, I will check that out, I do however have a kink in one of the pipes right before the muffler, but exhaust is flowing out through it rather smoothly, I am going to get that fixed this weekend. I doubt that it would cause that much restriction to cause these problems, but I will take the cat into consideration too, thanx.
Quote from: R Dubya on August 02, 2007, 12:12:01 PM
no need to use a scan tool you can pull the codes with a paperclip. On the diagnostic connector underneath the drivers side of the dash you can take a paperclip, bend it in a U shape, and ground the two connections on the top right of the connector. Do this with the key in the on position, but with the car off. It will flash a code three times, I believe it's 13, so it will blink once, pause, then blink 3 times quickly. It will repeat this 3 times. Then it will flash error codes in the same way. For example, it may Blink 3 times, pause, blink 3 times, which is a code 33. It will also repeat 3 times.
Sounds like you may have a clogged cat, but it could be host of problems. I had to replace the ECM in my machine once when it was stalling at highway speeds, but it would almost be a guarantee it wouldn't start again. Lay down on the ground next time it does it and see if the converter is glowing.
Actually the check code is code
12. :thumb:
And I do remember that, I did it on my old one with the paper clip, thanx for the reminder on that.
new problem, now it won't start, goin out to scan it now... :icon_frown:
Ok, I got a code 45, I can't find my book, can someone look that code up for me please :)
also after the scan, started right up no problem...?????
I just sat here for 5 min before tryin to start it...
I believe that it oxygen sensor circuit rich exhaust. Most likely you need to swap that sensor. Do you have a known good spare lying around anywhere? There are other potential causes for this, but swapping O2 sensors is the quickest way to diagnose if thats the problem. Could be bad fuel injectors, massive vacuum leaks, MAP sensor failure..
unfortunatly I don't have any spares hangin around from the old car... I was also thinking map sensor, cuz I remember when my old one had some rough idling and such, I replaced the map and it was a lot better after that. I didn't have a chance to really check the lines as the motor was pretty hot, so I plan to do that tomorrow, but now it's drinking time, so I will update tomorrow when I learn something new... :)
ok, had the cat checked and it's good, had the kinks fixed in the pipes.... and it is still lagging really bad.... It won't go past 85 or so, and at WOT and even close to WOT, it is hesitating really bad, and just not wanting to accelerate. I don't know what the hell is going on, I don't know what I should do, I don't want to do stuff and just waste money. So now, I am thinking that it is all fuel related... I checked, and code 45 is Oxygen Sensor Circuit (Rich Exhaust Indicated) .... but would that cause the lag that I am getting??... would that cause the stalling... idk.. When it comes to all that electronic crap, I am basically clueless, I mean, I can basically replace any part that I would need to, but when it comes to diagnostics, I am absolutely clueless...lol
My TGP ran kinda like that when my injectors died.... I had 3 dead injectors and teh other 3 were prolly dirty. The car would buck like crazy and want to die at anything over 1/2 throttle. I replaced all 6 fuel injectors with new C302 injectors for a 5.0 Mustang and the car runs almost like new now.
ya, tomorrow I am doin the fuel filter, then in the after noon bringing it to my friends garage to run some diags on it and check the fuel pressure and such....
Oh and with the bad injectors, it would die almost every time I stopped. If you have original injectors in your car, there is a good chance that they are bad.
X2! New injectors helped my TGP out quite a bit! I have the same injectors Nick is desribing. Ford Yellow Top C302 Injectors, for under $300 at the door. Beats stock, and yes they do fit right in.
Quote from: TGP Nick on August 06, 2007, 08:46:25 PM
Oh and with the bad injectors, it would die almost every time I stopped. If you have original injectors in your car, there is a good chance that they are bad.
I don't think I mentioned this before, but the car has less than 52k miles on it... so I can't see them being shot, but it happens...
It doesn't die every time I stop,... I just doesn't want to start, and doesn't like anything over half throttle... When I did get it started to get it home, it ran fine as long as I babied it like a gramma... if I tried to give it anything, it told me to go to hell basically..lol
Plus I don't have $300 to buy great injectors, or I woulda bought that front bumper that is being sold on here...lol
Mebbe if need be I will try to get some injectors in the junkyard... idk, this car is pissin me off more by the day...
Yeah that sounds exactly like how mine ran. And yes injectors can die even with that low mileage- they are electronic, so they can die that way and they can get plugged with a LOT of junk after 18 years. I got 6 new C302 injectors for $250.
I have a set of 6 C302 injector that have less than 100 miles on them. I thought my injectors were bad but they weren't, and five o motorsports don't take returns.
I'd be willing to part with them for 150 USD if you decide you need some injectors.
Meltboy, if you can afford it, take him up on this offer. You will not find them cheaper, and in the long run, it's cheaper than having your old ones pluse cleaned.
I will let you know tonight via PM if I will be buying them, I just want to make sure that is the problem before I buy them, not that I am doubting you, but I just want to be sure... )
sounds good
Ok... Got another engine code today, 33 for the MAP sensor... went to the junkyard and grabbed 3.... And go GM... the turbo uses a different MAP Sensor than the normal 3.1s... the connection is just different enough that they will not fit, I even tried my moms 91 regal, and that one was different too.... and the inside connector of the one off my Prix was orange, instead of black, and it looks as if someone had tried to change it before, cuz the little clip on it was broken. Also, had the fuel pressure checked, and it was runnin around 33-36 or so, and I checked my friends 94 to compare, and his was about the same. So looks like I will grab those injectors from ya, I will PM you some info and we can work the deal out...
pm'd ya back
Someone had mentioned the MAP sensor earlier... call me a dummy, but what exactly does the MAP sensor do.... just for kicks I unlpugged it, and it started up better than it normally does, idled a lot better, but wanted nothing to do with reving the engine, it sputtered like crazy... and unfrotunatly, after doing a little research, it appears that I can only use a MAP for the Turbo motor, no other MAP will work, so it looks like I might be stuck shelling out another $60 or so for one, unless someone might have an extra one collecting dust somewhere they might want to part with... lol
it senses the manifold pressure and applies the right amount of gas with the right amount of ignition timing so the car runs and performs well
that would sure explain the stalling then...lol well at least ima have a nice new set of injectors, and map sensor now thanx to you... :)
Will update when I get em in and installed and let ya guys know how it's running... :)
Put in the MAP and the injectors today, and it's like a totally different car, runs awsome!!
Still having a slight issue though, idk if it's cuz I had the battery disconnected and the car is relearning stuff, but when I am WOT at higher speeds, it still cuts out a little bit, it doesn't stall, but it's like the turbo just stops workin, the boost just goes down to 0, or below, and the RPMs stay at close to 5k or wherever it was at that time. I was also curious, the connector on the front of the plenum, with the lines from the wastegate, that is the actuator right?... why is there one spot where there is no vacuum line?
Also with boost... Where should it be at idle, I am way in the negative, is that normal? And also when I am at idle, and rev it, even though it only revs to 3k, it seems the wastegate doesn't move at all, is that also normal, sorry to ask so many noob questions, but I basically know jack about turbo vehicles, so this is a big learning experience for me.
Do u have the stock airbox? My TGP did the same thing, the boost went to 0 at high rpms, it turned out the airbox hosing was collapsing. Everything else sounds pretty normal
ya, I do, I will be ordering a cone next week if I have the extra money.
Update though.
I do think it was just the computer relearning, I took it out quite a bit last night and today, drove to the upstate ny club GP meet, which was about 170 miles away, and the car ran fantastic, wasn't cutting out or anything and very responsive. Only thing is at idle, sometimes it's a little choppy, I think it's just the car, it doesn't like not moving... it always wants to go...lol
Quote from: meltboy11 on August 11, 2007, 06:41:55 PM
it doesn't like not moving... it always wants to go...lol
Theres Pontiac for ya :laugh:
ya right, I know... like tonight, I was out, and I went to stop at a stop light, and it stalled out... I think I have a small vacuum leak though, I gotta check on that, I am hearing kinda like a hissing sound that seems like it is comin from under the plenum.
do u have the stock chip? If you do, thats probably why its stalling out. My TGP would CONSTANTLY stall out right when you come to a stop. It always did it when leaving the school parking lot, talk about embaressing. New chip i had some1 burn me and it has never dont it again.
ya, it is still stock chip. It hasn't stalled since that night, but it doesn't like to start. Only when it is cold though after not bein driven a couple days, as I don't drive the car all that often really. I think the fuel pump might be going possibly, what I have done is turn the key on and off a couple times to try to prime it, and it seems to start better when I do that, and once it is warm, it will start right up every time. Idle still a little rough at times, but that is random.
Mine has the stock chip and runs near perfect. Just because it has the stock chip doesn't mean it is the culprit.
there were several "versions" of the chip in the TGPs, there are a select few that cause stalling at stop lights and some other little issues. I cant remember the code for it tho.