and it's lean as hell! :icon_mad:
I just logged this 10 minutes ago, ~10 minute drive on the way to school for the first time. Something's wrong big time. (session 2)
edit: past 5 logs:
http://members.cox.net/gts-4x4/10.24-11.3.07.adl (1.8 MB)
btw - first one's notes are supposed to say "drive around neighborhood" not whatever jiberish I hit :icon_lol: is there anyway to edit this things once they're saved? I didn't even mean to save them all to the same adl, I just forget to start a new one.
here's one from the way home. only 1 knock count this time, but it's definetly running lean.
edit: log posted in above .adl (session 3)
I couldn't view the logs but it sounds like what Jimmys car was doing. We drove around with my scanner hooked up and it would show knock sometimes then other not knock. It kept pulling timming while doing it. It turned out to be the knock sensor was bad even though it passed the tests the FSM outlined for testing the knock sensor.
Tim
Could also be false knock. Make sure your downpipe or anything metal to metal is knocking around.
Also...welcome to having a manual transmission. Put your foot slightly on the clutch while logging to see if you have some throw-out bearing slop. How old is the tranny you put in? Was there output shaft or input shaft play? Slop in the tranny when you manually twisted the input shaft while in a gear?
I can not see the log either. What is your 02 readings? Is the 02 sensor new? Are you sure all of your manifold and cross-over pipe connections are sealed? You do not have to have an audible leak to have a leak!
When you say your knock count is 70...is that accumulated or is there a given throttle position and load point that it all of a sudden starts climbing in counts?
I definetly have something that knocks around when I shift.. so this could be due to that. All motor mounts are new.. I dunno, I'll have to do more investigating. Sounds like something's hitting the firewall.
you guys can't see the logs? It's in excel format.. so I dunno. try saving and opening? I have no problem downloading/viewing them from either of my computers..
Quote from: TGPilot on November 02, 2007, 06:36:37 AM
Also...welcome to having a manual transmission. Put your foot slightly on the clutch while logging to see if you have some throw-out bearing slop. How old is the tranny you put in? Was there output shaft or input shaft play? Slop in the tranny when you manually twisted the input shaft while in a gear?
I can not see the log either. What is your 02 readings? Is the 02 sensor new? Are you sure all of your manifold and cross-over pipe connections are sealed? You do not have to have an audible leak to have a leak!
When you say your knock count is 70...is that accumulated or is there a given throttle position and load point that it all of a sudden starts climbing in counts?
tranny had about ~70k on it iirc. wasn't any slop that I remember. throwout bearing and clutch are brand new.
I know I definetly have to do a recheck for leaks.. exhaust side's fine, I'm just thinking intake side/vacumm leaks.
In the first log the knock was 70 right off the bat, when I hit record.. it didn't increase at all but I did have ~2 seconds worth of retard later on. I think that must've been a fluke.
In the second log I had 1 count.
TPS voltage - 2.12,
MAP load voltage - 3.7
BLM - 128
RPM - 3125
Engine Flow - 255 g/s - highest I see in the log, it was there for about 2 seconds prior
O2 - 814.14 mV
O2 Cross Counts - 185 (I dunno what this means)
Inj Final Pulse Width - 11.7 mSec
Spark Adv relative to TDC - 15.47 / Spark Adv - 45.7
Knock Retard - 2.64
That's about the jist of it. This was done in TunerPro RT
O2 sensor is a brand new heated Delco unit. Readings are all over the place, which I know is normal, but they were extreme - anywhere from 78 to 1028 mV. I know that doesn't really help without looking at the full picture, but 1028 is way too lean as far as I know. my narrowband A/F gauge stays red/yellow most of the time while cruising, and at WOT it stays yellow/green.
Do you guys want me to post the tunerpro log files?
TP datalog file is the only way I will be able to see it.
car died on me today.. brand new batt and different alt and it's running much better. still not right, but better. I had no knocks on the trip after the parts swap :)
I'll post the tunerpro files when I get home.
edit: sessions 4 and 5
Quote from: GutlessSupreme on November 02, 2007, 07:36:07 AM
O2 sensor is a brand new heated Delco unit. Readings are all over the place, which I know is normal, but they were extreme - anywhere from 78 to 1028 mV. I know that doesn't really help without looking at the full picture, but 1028 is way too lean as far as I know. my narrowband A/F gauge stays red/yellow most of the time while cruising, and at WOT it stays yellow/green.
Do you guys want me to post the tunerpro log files?
Tony, 1028 is rich, not lean. I briefly viewed the log you had and everything I saw looked ok, I did not view much of it though because I don't have Excel or whatever is needed to properly view those .CSV format files. Post the .ADL file from TunerPro and it would be easier for all of use to view.
.adl posted
I know my bin needs some help.. wasn't tuned for my 24lb Ford injectors or head porting, plus I have no idea how fast I'm going :willynilly: Davis made it for me as a custom 5 speed chip, along the lines of the tune he used for his Cutlass.
I edited my posts so you know what sessions I'm talking about.
The car runs ok... but not strong. It feels as if there's a miss, and it sounds funny. I need to pull all the plugs and check them, check fuel pressure, and I'm thinking about having the injectors tested/cleaned. I want to pull the valve covers and make sure all the rockers are tight and moving lol. It almost sounds like an exhaust leak, which could be my 3rd :rolleyes: EGR pipe. really need a real solution for that.
btw, all plugs are brand new R42LTS', and the wires were brand new one's I had gotten from Davis that seemed of good quality. I forget what I gapped the plugs to... maybe 30.
just an update.. the "missing" feeling is only there are low RPMs/under load. Once the revs are up it's very strong... hehe.
Also, some other issues..
at low RPMs/speed, obviously the engine bucks a little because me = n00b w/ 5 speed. I know Josh said his bucked a lot but I don't remember under what conditions. Well anyway, I hear a lot of knocking around during the bucking... I haven't figured out what it is yet. I really need to check the lower mounts and make sure they're secure.
The GM tranny mount I got from that vintageparts.com place was in kinda shitty shape to begin with.. looked like a defective leftover. Maybe even flimsy. I'm kinda worried about it, but don't know a solution. I don't know how I could get a custom replacement made and I imagine it wouldn't be cheap, reguardless. I also want to remove the inter. shaft bracket and have that rewelded (me and friend had to make one), I don't want the welds to sheer. I can't figure out what else would be knocking.
Well I was hoping mostly to have Davis help me fool with the chip a little since he made it for me.. but he seems to have all but dissapeared :icon_confused: I'm gonna need some help from you guys then.
Does anyone have any thoughts on the logs? I pretty much need this tuned by next week :willy_nilly: I need to get a reader/burner quick..
just swapped injectors back to stocks (or maybe DOHC injectors? one or the other) and cleaned the IAC. I had to disconnect the battery for a few mins because it was idling at 2500 again lol. idles lower now but it's still running a bit rough, I assume it just needs to relearn. we'll see how it turns out.. wish me luck
oh, also snapped another fucking intake bolt :icon_evil: don't think I mentioned that before.
make sure you use the correct year LIM with your UIM :icon_rolleyes: I'm using a '92 LIM off a Lumina and the bolts/holes are really narrow. The '90 plenum has large bolt holes, and the bolts are sleaved in some kind of rubber insulator and are bigger. so the proper bolts for the plenum don't fit the LIM, so I'm using the narrow ass LIM bolts and they have a huge amount of space in the plenum bolt holes. I've snapped two trying to torque them down to 20 ft-lbs. with and without washers under them.
kind of pita to do but i would try to get a '90 LIM back in there with the correct bolts of course, and use a paper style gasket. are you using the metal/o-ring plenum gaskets now?
fwiw mine bucked worse the lower the gear i was in. 1st gear was unbearable, 2nd was really bad, 3rd was "ok" and it really didn't seem to buck at all in 4th or 5th. no bucking at all on the highway. it mostly bucked when trying to maintain a steady speed in 1st through 3rd gears. i hated it so much that i really don't miss the car at all :(
I hate pulling the LIM :mad: I'm using paper felpro gaskets, not the o-ring style ones.
I thought you finally got the bucking sorted out? between that engine ground and Kenny's tune. With the Ford injectors, there seemed to be a lot of driveability problems overall, some bucking included. It wasn't even so much bucking, it felt more like a miss, but just under medium load. It drove pretty good on stock injectors once the computer got used to it, but on initial starting on a cold day, it runs like aboslute shit for at least a minute. Uncontrollable bucking in drive, fine at idle/neutral. I know there's the possibility of an intake leak being present, then the motor warms up and it seals. But I don't think that explains why it doesn't do it in neutral. I was having thoughts that maybe it has to do with the clutch material? Spec stage 3 - maybe it doesn't like the cold much :shrug: could also be oil leaking onto the clutch. Now that I think about it, that makes perfect sense. It could hit a dry spot/slippery spot on the flywheel and act like ABS on the crankshaft. I do have an oil leak coming from the rear of the motor, and I'm fairly sure it's the plate at the end of the cam gallery because I decided to seal it with RTV instead of the supplied cork gasket :shrug: It drips out of and down the bellhousing from where the starter is.
It would very occasionally still shoot up to ~3k+ rpms when coming to a stop, but once I got moving again it would go away. It stalled out completely more often than that (at stops / reverse-to-1st). I remember somebody else having this problem with a getrag swap, has to be chip related.