All right guys I have been fighting this issue for awhile. It first started with my radiator springing a leak. Changed it out. Now it will idle all day long and not go above 180. But if I take it for a cruise it pops on low coolant light and then my temp just climbs till it pegs(fast) burnt up 2 coolant temp switches and blow my heater core hose. When I start the car with my radiator cap of it shoots water up to the hood. Any help or things to try will be apperiated.
Thanks,
Shawn
Do you have all the air out of the coolant system? do you have a clogged heater pipe or something? That is weird......
Ken
Well awhile ago I used the famously terrible bars leak but I flushed my cooling system since. I am leaning towards that. But why does it stay cool at idle but when I drive it about a mile it acts up. I have let it run and unscrewed both bleeders and got nothing but coolant at idle. But get steam after I drive it.
I'm sorry, is your primary fan working correctly? Reason why ask is mine did the same thing and found the relay that works the primary had a loose connection and would shut off going down the road and make it run hot. Once I crimped on a new connector problem solved. may or may not help,but good luck
As far as I know it works fine. Just ask my thumb it sliced my thumb when I was checking the bottom hose. HAHA
any steam coming out the tail pipe? does the radiator puff with the cap off? Those aluminum heads will warp real quick at those temps and cause blowby in the coolant system.
Are you losing any coolant?
As far as I can tell I am not losing anyexcept when something else blows out. I did a compression test and all cylinders are around 100 to 120. I hope I finally got it fixed, but wont know till I get home. As for smoke from the exhaust, I have a little bit but when idling it smells like fuel. It always ran abit rich. the coolant does sound like it is bubbling when it is running.
100-120 PSI? Wow thats really low.
I have done a test on my TGP and Krenzy's old TGP and they were both about 165 PSI.
Water pump perhaps.. I've seen the propeller blades rust off...
Good point, and cheep fix Adam
brand new water pump is only a year old. I will be home tomorrow. I will check it out more then. Hoping for the best
Well I have been fighting this issue for a long time. But look at these and tell me if I found my problem. That shouldnt be there,HAHA. I tore it all apart today. I guess we will find out tomorrow when I get her running. I will keep everyone updated.
yeah that is a problem
glad you found it, make sure you use a straight edge on the heads to make sure they're not warped or you'll have to do this again! been down that road before...
Yep, That will do it every time...
Alright guys here is an update. Replaced both head gaskets, new head bolts, LIM, UIM,and valve cover gaskets. After that it ran worse then before. Replaced plugs still like crap. Found what I thought was a bad plug wire(wrong). It ended up being a bad coil. But it was only for the number 3 cylinder. Anyone ever hear of a coil going bad on just one cylinder. But thats not the kicker. It also had 2 pounds of boost instead of 10 or 11 as usual. Found that there is oil in the turbo vacuum line.(not the wastegate side). So I think my turbo that was rebuilt 2 years ago now has to be rebuilt or I go with a 2817. This is my luck with this car. One good note is it now idles the best it ever did.Footnote even with vacuum lines off turbo I have no boost now. Any ideas befre I get another turbo for it.
Thanks,
Shawn
What kind of gauge are you using? The stock gauge for reading boost is terrible. Try hooking everything back up like it should, then take a reading straight from the plenum for boost ref. If that still yields nothing good, pressurize the wastegate actuator see it that holds pressure and moves when applied.
I have an aftermarket boost gauge. And it is hooked up and works fine. My actuator does hold pressure.
If the turbo worked fine before you took the heads off its probably something that didnt get back together right. What is your firing order from left to right on the coil packs? Did you take compression test when you were done? Those are things i would check first. A blown diaphram on the wastegate would create an overboost not underboost.
Well compression is great around 140 across the board. It was running about 10 lbs of boost since Thursday, but didnt run good at all. Spit and sputtered and bogged down. Now no boost and car idles great and runs strong minus boost of course. No engine noise at all. Engine is so health minus NO BOOST.
Is your crossover cracked?
If any a little bit. But it has always been like that. But my concern is the oil in the vacuum line coming of the turbo going to my selinoid. With it unhooked it coats the front of my engine with oil slatter. I t didnt do this till this morning. And with my seliniod unhooked it never went above 8 lbs of boost. With a kenny hot tune chip which should produce 12 lbs like it used to do till my head gasket went out. With the lines off it should of over boosted but it never reached close to that.
hrmm interesting.
sounds like the intercooler pipe popped off, check the clamps and couplers there. The oil probly got sucked in from the crankcase breather on your valve cover... that is if you have the stock airbox setup.
no factory air box. K&N air filter, and breather. All intercooler piping is on and tight
PCV good?
I once did this to "test" turbo seals. I brought the turbo over the the bench, installed some barbed fittings, then clamped on some oil lines and fed it first cold oil then second test was with hot oil. I used 0w30 oil. It did show me oil puking out the compressor side, but this was on a different turbo..... Could it work for you, maybe. Should you try this, up to you.
PCV is new. This is terrible. Turbo was rebuilt 2 years old and has about 1200 miles on it. This car has fought my every step of the way. Just about everything is new on the car.(mechanical wise). Every sensor, vacuum line, plugs, wires, DIS, and coils all have 1200 miles or less on them and still fighting it. UUUGGGHHHH
Ok guys I am offically an idiot. I guess when I did a quick check of everything I missed my lower intercooler hose popped off. Hence no turbo spool. Insult to injury I had me wastegate accuator vacuum lines crossed. Dumb ass!!! Well car runs great, idles fine except above 8 lbs. It bucks and backfires. But it might be some weak coils or something in my gas tank. If you rock my car there is something banging in there. Over the winter plans. New coils,DIS,gas tank, sending unit and pump. Just because they are 19 years old.
Gald to hear you got it figured out :icon_mrgreen:
good to know it was something simple! if you have the stock chip the car will cut out at 8 PSI but you shouldnt be hitting boost cut if the solenoid is hooked up correctly.
I have a Kenny hot tune chip.
oops, didnt see that. The EGR hose is very easy to break, theres a flex sheild over it so its hard to see if its broke or not. That will make the car boost like crap. Is it loud under the hood? Any check engine codes come up?
It is not loud. Yeah I know about that EGR tube I broke it before. I never fought a EGR like that in my life to get it back on. No SES light either. I am just happy it idles and doesnt stall all the time. It really doesnt run that bad. Just when I go WOT. With car I will take this anyday.
no kidding, btw where did you get a replacement egr pipe or did you repair it with something?
Quote from: killinprixs on November 11, 2008, 03:26:04 PM
no kidding, btw where did you get a replacement egr pipe or did you repair it with something?
There are a few posts here about using the EGR pipe off one of the older 2.8 cars(not sure if it was w-body specific 2.8 cars or one of the other platforms though). I'm planning on eventually fabbing up a braided stainless line for the egr for my cars. I probably won't get around to that until I actually break one of the pipes though. :laugh:
Yeah I just went to the junkyard and got on off a 2.8. It works just fine.
Well update time again. I was just planning on putting my 91-93 overflow bottle in today, but that wasnt good enough for me. I had to try some tests out to narrow down my spit and sputter issue. Long story short took it for a quick run. Heard something pop and man did it run like crap. Idle was fubared AGAIN. just about gave up for about the millionth time. But for shits and giggles I changed my coils with ones from my GTP and wow she is running great no spit no sputter. Now I get to tackle that pain they call a transmission modulator vavle. Car runs great if I manually shift, but not when I have it in just OD. It sems to either slip or something, but if I manually shift it is fine.
Quote from: dogginred90 on November 15, 2008, 05:49:03 AM
Well update time again. I was just planning on putting my 91-93 overflow bottle in today, but that wasnt good enough for me. I had to try some tests out to narrow down my spit and sputter issue. Long story short took it for a quick run. Heard something pop and man did it run like crap. Idle was fubared AGAIN. just about gave up for about the millionth time. But for shits and giggles I changed my coils with ones from my GTP and wow she is running great no spit no sputter. Now I get to tackle that pain they call a transmission modulator vavle. Car runs great if I manually shift, but not when I have it in just OD. It sems to either slip or something, but if I manually shift it is fine.
I got that overflow on my TGP, I like it.
As for your coils I don't know if it helps or not but I put some reflective tape on the back side of my COIL pack bracket where it attaches to the engine, thinking it may reflect some heat away from it.
Lastly have you ever had your tranny power flushed? IIRC when Kenny bought my old white TSTE he thought the tranny was slipping, then got it power flushed and it shifted just fine.
Keep the faith, eventually it will all come together.
Dont power flush it, bad bad idea, what you want is called a fluid exchange, where a machine uses the transmissions pump to circulate the old fluid out on a tank and the tank of new fluid in its place, so every bit of fluid is changed, not Forcedm through the tranny, then they do a pan drop and filter change and your done! Had it done to my TGP, it started delaying when shifting, so i had that done shifts nice and quick again
Thanks alot for the info. I will think about doing it later this week if this modulator doesnt work out.
Quote from: Prospeeder on November 15, 2008, 06:37:01 PM
Dont power flush it, bad bad idea, what you want is called a fluid exchange, where a machine uses the transmissions pump to circulate the old fluid out on a tank and the tank of new fluid in its place, so every bit of fluid is changed, not Forced through the tranny, then they do a pan drop and filter change and your done! Had it done to my TGP, it started delaying when shifting, so i had that done shifts nice and quick again
I believe we are talking about the same thing, just calling it different names :icon_cool:
Typical Transmission Flush:
The typical flush machine connects to the transmission cooler lines. Several manufacturers make this machine and this is how it works. The machine carries new fluid to the line going to the cooler. There is a chamber on the machine with a diaphragm. The top part of the chamber above the diaphragm is filled with new fluid. The engine is started which turns the torque converter and the input shaft on the transmission. The input shaft turns the transmission pump creating hydraulic pressure which forces fluid to flow through the cooler line. As fluid leaves the cooler line, it enters the chamber on the flush machine. As the old fluid side of the diaphragm fills, it pushes the diaphragm up and forces new fresh fluid into the transmission. After a while, the old fluid is collected in the machine and it is replaced by new fluid. Now the transmission has been flushed. The machine causes no pressure and all fluid transfer is done by the transmission's own pump. The problem with this type of machine is that it does not remove all of the old fluid, but continuously dilutes the old fluid with new fluid. It never really removes all of the old fluid, but it is far superior to just a "drain and fill.
Pump inlet flush machine "Power Flush"
The pump inlet flush machine attaches to the pump intake after the pan and filter are removed. This machine supplies only fresh new fluid to the pump intake. As the new fluid passes through the transmission, it dumps into a collection tray and never goes back through for a second pass. All of the old fluid is GONE and replaced with fresh new fluid. After the service, a new filter is installed, the pan is replaced and then it is topped off with new fluid to the proper dipstick level. This process takes a total of about 20 quarts of fluid to flush out 15 quarts of old fluid and replace the fluid. It also gives the mechanic the opportunity to look in the pan for anything unusual that would indicate a pending failure. This type of flush does take more effort, makes more of a mess, and it costs a little more.
Ok so I changed modulator valves today. It still stutters bad if I left it shift on its own. But if I manually shift it, it shifts good. But after a little run it doesnt downshift now. I hope I can keep it together over the winter. I will be looking to go 5 speed i n the spring I guess.
Is the T.V. cable good? Is there a check valve on the modulator? Ever change the filter/fluid? Does it downshift if you manually do it ? Did u adjust the modulator?
TV cable does click when adjusted, yes it has a check vavle installed,fluid and filter was changed this past summer, yes it manual downshifts, I adjusted it to the left about 1 full turn total it didnt help. I will mess with it more tomorrow. It was downshifting for awhile after I installed the modulator then it just stopped after about 2 miles.
What RPM is it shifting at at WOT? (not by looking at the tach, they are inaccurate)
the check valve only goes one way, if you reverse it it'll mess things up.
At WOT it shutters bad (whole car feels like it is going down a bumpy dirt road) It seems to shift a little high but not to bad. Check vavle is hooked up I think right anyone have a picture of how it is suppose to be
(http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j195/blackswift99/My%20TGP%20Projects/MyTGP001-1.jpg)
If your check valve goes bad, it will shift funky too. HELP! #47150 is the check valve you need. I've gone through so many I have the part # memorized :laugh:
Thanks alot for the pic Nick that was a big help I see the bigger section is open. I think I might have mine wrong. I will check it tomorrow morning and update.
No problem ;) Like I said, make sure the valve is functioning also, and make sure the vacuum lines are connected securely and don't have any splits/cracks in them.
Killinprixs and Nick, thanks alot you guys. Both of you helped fix the issue. I did have the check valve backwards, and the modulator vavle needed fine tuned. No hopifully I can drive it for more then 2 days without something breaking. :icon_rolleyes: If anyone that has helped me comes into Altoona, PA hit me up I owe you guys atleast a BBQ and some beers.
:thumb:
no problem! glad to hear you got it right!
Ok WTF is going on. I take the TGP out for a nice cruise before the snow flies again. Well I drove it for 20 minutes, all the sudden no heat, look down at gauge it is climbing. Ok I think just that slow leak from the radiator. No problem just add some antifreeze. Go to pull out from her place, and it looks like a huge smoke screen coming from the exhaust. WTF!!! 1Block later it quits smoking temp is still trying to climb. Get to parts store add antifreeze. Car ran great the 20 miles home, till I fill it up with fuel and pull away. SMOKE SCREEN AGAIN. Get home pull rad cap and start car anti freeze shoots out. Now I know that those damn felpro head gaskets are junk already. It will have to wait till it gets warmer. Sorry guys had to vent a little.
I feel your pain about everytime you turn around these cars need something. My wife can't understand (and just being honest i can't either) why we feel compelled to keep these things together! :icon_confused: Must be the challenge, because I can't help it! It think it must be the exhilaration we get when they actually run like they are capable of or in some cases when we remember back to days when they ran like they should. To quote a line from the bug that went to the light in A Bug's Life, "I just can't help it, it's so beautiful!!" Keep the faith. I keep telling my wife this everytime I discuss my plans on how to upgrade or fix another problem. All of the guys on this forum are great!! ;)
All I know is that this sucks. I am not giving up on this. I will tear it apart and put it back together again and again. I am a sucker for a cute face, and god is she cute. Even if she is 4 colors and blows head gaskets after 1,000 miles of giving her new head gaskets. Compression check coming as soon as the weather gets better.
I know this has been discussed before, but I cant find out the truth. Will 2.8 heads work alright on our 3.1 turbo motors. I have a spare set of 2.8 heads laying around. I am afraid I might have a warped head. Just curious about this.
You really should have had the heads checked for warpage and possibly shaved before installing new headgaskets. Since it's likely leaking again, the heads probably are warped.
Yeah I know. Whats bad is I knew that then, but I was stupid. Oh well wont make that mistake twice. My 2.8 heads are still on the motor and that ran great, but I will be getting them checked, if they will be good enough to use. I think they will work fine, but need someone to confirm that.
There are some small differences in the casings especially as the later years progressed. To my knowledge the 2.8 vs 3.1 differences are attribuited to mainly the crank and the wrist pin height in the piston. Thats basically it so 2.8 heads should work fine. This is all what I have been told.
Ken
I knew the crank was different, and thought the heads would be close enough to use. So thats good we will find out at a later date. Thanks Ken
Well guys here is an update on the dogginred90. She got tore apart yesterday and found both head gaskets were blown. Upon further inspection of the heads I found both were cracked. UUGGHHH. But got a set of 2.8 heads that the machine shop said will be done tomorrow, so it will be back on the road tomorrow evening again.
I just did headgaskets on my 6000's 3.1.... I hope my felpro headgaskets dont blow, lol, are you pretty sure your heads just were no good then?? My gaskets just blew, no overheat nothin, just pullin a steep hill gave her abit too much throttle and pop! The heads were flat and in good shape i just reused them.
I am thinking the heads were shot before. I just didnt see it then. The machine shop cooked them and found the cracks. 4 cracks where the spark plugs go, and the rear head had 2 cracks from the water jackets. There were more cracks on the rear head, I take it that one is the one that got cooked from overheating. I guess it just took time for the gasket to give before the second blow. LOL. 2.8 heads are good from what he says, so it is going to be good.