5 speed owners look here

[god910]

So, I've been doing some pre-tuning on my UTEC (User Tuneable Engine Controller) for my Rex, and it got me thinking...

One of the major advantages to driving an auto turbo car is being able to launch under boost.  And never having to let off to shift.  How would you like the best of both worlds?  I know this will place heavy loads on the transmission and axles, but if we're talking about cutting some SERIOUS times, this will help a ton.  I've got the ideas kicking around in my head, but not gonna let them out unless people want to hear.  W/o going back and looking at all the stuff I've forgotten from my previous flirt w/ the TGP MEMCAL, I'm 99.99% sure I can do this.  I might even try it on a chip (or explain it to someone that is willing to try it).  LMK.

[Invasion1]

Due Tell.....but only me  :lol:

you know where to find me... :wink:

[TGPilot]

Well if you can figure out how to incorporate an Anti-Lag system with the GM Memcal...you will be my HERO! You will need to have another piggyback system like they have with the OBD1 DSM's made by DSMLink.

But hey if you can figure it out by all means...but if you do that incorpoate a no lift to shift mode also! :wink:  8)

[god910]

Well, anti-lag is VERY hard on your exhaust parts and turbo.  Most Rallyx users that incorporate anti lag replace turbo's and headers every 25000 miles or so.  I was thinking the NL2S (No lift to shift) was going to be equally easy, because it's essentially just a different step of the rev. limiter, but then I remembered that the utec uses the SAME inputs for it, difference being it changes it's RPM selector from launch control to NL2S over 13 mph.  So, to get both, we'd have to add some code.  I can program anti-lag into your MEMCAL if you'd like, it's really nothign more than DUMPING fuel in upon rapid RPM decrease (IE when you shift) Maybe cut a few IGN cycles for good measure.  When it explodes in your exhaust, it spools the turbo VERY quickly.  I've got some sick ass video of a very high HP Scoob running anti-lag.  I'll try and find the link I dl'd it from.

[twinturbosedan]

is anti-lag really nothing but a programmed backfire to quickly spool the turbo?  i haven't heard much about this at all....

no lift to shift...what is that?  not lifting on the go-pedal while shifting?  if so, what kind of changes are made to the code?  i've thought about trying that (just keeping the throttle to the floor while shifting), as my brother has done that with his TDs with GREAT results, but i'm a chicken shit :lol:  and i haven't exactly had good luck with 282s.

they both sound dangerous.  i'm not sure if i'd have the balls to actually try either.  i just don't have the money for a new turbo or another 282.  i never really get to the track either; my Cutlass is nothing more than a quick pizza delivery mobile at the moment.

[god910]

Basically the ALS is just that a wicked backfire that keeps the turbo spooled up.  W/ our T25 we don't so much need that, and IMHO we don't need much of a NL2S (Which yes, is just that, you program a pre-set RPM and when it sees an input (ie, the clutch switch) it looks to whatever RPM limiter you set and bounces off that, holding boost.)  My buddy w/ an Evo 8 holds about 21 psi between shifts.  Wowsa.  You keep the go pedal down while shifting.  Alot different than "power shifting" which IMO is Impossible in a cable driven car.  I tried it in my TGP and was horribly enlightened by the crunching of gears.  I can do it all day long in my sisters fork driven (direct) S-10.  I can make a 4 cylinder s-10 do doughnuts when it shifts into 2nd by "power shifting" (Ie not letting off, just hammering the next gear w/ the shifter and dumping the clutch)  NL2S lowers the RPM to whatever you set instead of raising it radically like power shifting.

The launch control can be hard on the driveline, but the NL2S is not that bad, it's actually better than a clutch dump.

[z284pwr]

I can make a 4 cylinder s-10 do doughnuts when it shifts into 2nd by "power shifting" (Ie not letting off, just hammering the next gear w/ the shifter and dumping the clutch)

Yes, that is how you do it, my parents used to do that all the time, just put the clutch in a little before redline, and shift fast, works good...... :lol: Them Corvairs didn't seem to be phased in the least, Though V8 7000 RPM clutch drops were a bit different on them...

Besides, what are you trying to do here?  If its drag racing, *bracket racing* you may as well get an automatic just because of consistency, if its for more of Autocross/Road racing, the slight lag between gear shifts shouldn't really be something to be worried about

[god910]

I'm talking about basically eliminating the only thing the auto guys have on the 5 speed guys.  No launch boost, and having to lift (Loose boost) when shifting.  So, you get shorter gears, more fun to drive, not having to worry about overheating your tranny, etc.

[skalor]

I've thought about incorporating the park/netural rev limiter as a launch control device.  When I did my swap I just left the auto park/neutral safety switch in park so it would start and I cut the wire the runs to the ECM to let it know it was in park/neutral.  I believe it was a black wire with a white stripe, but that's not really the important part.  The important part is the it was grounded when in park/neutral and left open in any other gear.  So, all that I would have to do is run that wire to a momentary switch and ground it to enable the rev limiter.  Then set the rev limiter to whatever rpm I want for the launch rpm.  So, when you're on the line you can just floor it and it will only rev to the desired rpm, and when the light goes green you just drop the clutch and let go of the button.  I was also thinking that instead of using a switch that I could use the factory clutch saftey switch instead so that whenever the clutch in the rev limiter is on.  I don't know how that would work when shifting though as the rev limiter will be enabled momentarily.   :?

[TGPilot]

I don't know how that would work when shifting though as the rev limiter will be enabled momentarily.   :?

No lift to shift in a way... :wink:

[god910]

Okay.  For some reason I was just thinking about this thread.  I didn't see these last 2 reply's over a year ago  :icon_rolleyes: Skalor has it right, but what I'd be more apt to do is bridge the ground contact to the clutch pedal.  Maybe even with a micro switch?  But remember, if you don't set the switch right it'll over rev. as soon as the switch opens.  It's overcome in the UTEC with a WSS.  It knows you're not "launching" anymore by reading it, and seeing more than 13 mph (high in 1st gear)

Josh, the whole purpose behind the NL2S is that when you engage the switch, it HOLDS a pre-set RPM.  This particular RPM would be whatever you set it the Park/Neutral RPM rev. limiter at. 

Has anybody popped this part of the ECM?  It's been SOOOOO long since I've been in a TGP binary it's rediculous.  Can someone check if you can modify that?  IMHO, it might be perfect at 3K though (isn't that the stock setting?)  I'll test all this out when I get the car running again.  I don't care if it breaks.   :laugh:  I've got mine in the WRX set at 6000 but I haven't used it yet.  That's what I launch at.   :icon_twisted:

[scott0999]

so this is kinda like the stutter box for dsm's?

[mars]

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haha

I decided to bump it, as it has alot of usefull information.

Just wanted to know if anyone here had tried this out.

What was the result ?

I am talking about hooking up the park/nertral switch to get consistant launches with my manual car.

Anyone ??

[skalor]

I never tried it because I sold my car to Kuntzie.   :icon_razz:

[mars]

Again Back from the dead.

I just went out and tried grouding that blk/org wire to ground, and it does nothing...  revs to 6k easily, and no other ill effects.  In theory this should be fooling my ECM into thiking the car is in park, thus activating the park rev limiter...

Can someone send me a KNOWN bin that actually has a Park Neut. rev limiter that works ??

I am using a 7730 ECM, so maybe this is my problem...

Also, in my XDF file I have :

Park neutral overrev fuel restore : 2999 RPM  (BB7)
Park Neutral overrev fut cutoff : 3000 RPM (BB8)
Return all fuel if RPM<= 5975 RPM (0EF)
Shutoff all fuel is RPM >=  5775 RPM (0E7)
Soft rev limiter cutoff :  6375 RPM (FF)
Soft rev limiter restore : 6375 RPM (FF)

I think that something is WAY wrong here, my car revs to 6500+ easily while doing a burnout...  Maybe the scaling is way off in my .xdf, which could be causing me a problem ???


EDIT :

Nevermind, this works mint.

I just have to raise it to around 5500 RPM and set the P/N MPH override to 1 MPH and it works excellent.

I'll prolly blow my engine up, but the sound this makes is sooo worth it !!

so, basically TGP chip has a built in 2 step rev limiter !!  most excellent!!