I've read some past postings about camshaft wear on #9 and#10 camshaft lobes. What were the symptoms? Thanks for any replies. :twitch:
sounds like a wrx... drone in the exhuast, valvetrain noise, loss of power, slightly lower compression in one cylinder, loose pushrods... anyone else?
Quote from: killinprixs on December 20, 2008, 04:37:54 PM
sounds like a wrx... drone in the exhuast, valvetrain noise, loss of power, slightly lower compression in one cylinder, loose pushrods... anyone else?
Besides those, worn lobes can cause backfiring.
Mine just picked up a skip at idle. when taking one plug wire off at a time narrowed it to number 5 cylinder.
This is the only cylinder that did not change the rpm when plug wire pulled off. replaced plug and wire.
tested coil with spark tester at end of number 5 wire while running. Had plenty of fire. Don't notice it skipping as bad at slight ly higher rpm. can also hear it "thumping at tailpipe. :icon_cry: One other symptom I noticed was when going WOT from a stop it would accelerate goold but then make a muffled bump in the engine one time and then I would lose almost all power. does this every time under WOT. :damnit1:Engine would still run but only about 2000 rpm. If I pushed throttle any at all it the rpms would drop and car would shut off if throotle pushed far enough. After about 30 seconds of it running this way it would magically go back to accelerating normally again. I wonder if it backfired and overboosted the engine causing the computer to stop acceleration. I have replaced just about everything on this engine and rebuilt the tranny. Thanks for all of your replies! I should also note that I have no problems at part throttle as I routinely go to work on the interstate at 95+ MPH. SHHH!!!
Have you replaced the ignition module, and not the coils the box....I have had weird stuff go on when that thing goes out. On and the pfhh pfhh pfhh at idle is a normal tgp idle hahahah. They all do that a little bit.
Ken
Yeah, I did replace all the coils and ignition module when I had the engine out. However, did go aftermarket. Read posts after replacing them saying not to go aftermarket so that could be a problem.
In my experience with a failed #10 lobe, the car would idle rough, seemingly indicating a failed ICM. You could hear the boost come back into the engine bay when accelerating, it would accelerate, but would eventually fall on its face and sometimes even stall out while rolling. I however had bent pushrods, and that made the diagnosis to that cylinder relatively easy. Compression would obviously not be there if there was no cam lobe, but I'm not sure how much wear it would take to make a noticeable effect on driveability. It's hard for me to give a concrete diagnosis, because I know I had crap Bosch injectors installed, and that they weren't working right either, so that could have complicated things.
I removed the rear rocker cover and manually turned the engine, found that the lifter/pushrod asm was not moving the rocker. You can always remove the pushrods to investigate, or you can remove the LIM and check and compare lifter movement from cylinder to cylinder as well. I wouldn't be surprised to find out the problem was with that injector or all of them? Have you checked those?
If the cam has failed, it is possible to replace it without removing the engine, and although it would be recommended to replace main/rod bearings, it is not entirely necessary.
Hey, thanks for the last post. That is exactly what mine is doing. I had noticed before it got the noticeabel skip and exhaust pipe noise change that the car seemed to get extremely winded above 3000 rpm and the acceleration dropped way off above this rpm. Maybe the cam is causing that too. I have the factory injectors in the car that it came with. I do not have one of the GM factory fuel injector testers that allow you to watch preesure drop on each injector. Wish I did! Well, I have kept the engine stock and have never gone into the motor other than to reseal it. Guess now I'll probably go with a more powerful cam and change the injectors as well. I wonder if I will get any power gain this way using the stock turbo? Also, if anyone has any cam recommendations in terms of lift, duration and brand it would be very helpful. The last question I have is what causes cam failure on these lobes and what will prevent this from happening to a new cam? Thanks for everyone's advice and help. This forum is a life saver because the OBD 1 diagnostics suck on these cars. Service manual really not much help either!! :icon_biggrin:
i would just do a compression check and if its good i bet its the stock injectors.
in this case, you aren't necessarily looking for leak down on the injectors, you are really looking to find out if it is pulsing the way it should be. a leak down test on these cars is simple. simply remove the fuel rail/injector assembly from the LIM and pressurize the system, make sure the engine isn't hot obviously, and its probably a good idea to have an extinguisher nearby. if the injectors drip, you know thats at least part of your problem, but as killinprixs said, if you are getting good compression its likely not the camshaft.
You could always ohm them all out to find out if there are any major differences in the resistance. I do not know the proper numbers off hand, I believe it is no less than 12 ohms on any injector? someone confirm that please.
either way, good luck with figuring it out.
You can also get a fuel pressure gauge to check the injectors and make sure they hold pressure after key on for 2-3 minutes. Should be around 40 psi if I remember correctly.
Ken
Does anyone have any suggestions on which cam to use to get a little more power with the stock motor and turbo/ECM setup? Also need to know which injectors to get. Thanks for everyone's input.
I'v spent a lot of time going through past posts over the years ont this forum to try to select a good cam replacement for my stock TGP. I saw mentioned a couple of Crane cams. One had 480 lift and 284 duration with 112 sep. Another choice was a 440 lift and 266 duration with 114 sep. Also recommended 26lb injectors and valve springs if I want to hit 6500 rpm. Do any of you have experience with these setups? Who makes the 26lb injectors recommended and what valve springs do I need? Has anyone gotten their motor to run at 6500 rpm and be streetable with good idle? So many questions and dreams of increasing performance but so small budget! Also who burns chips to make these perform better besides JeffM. Also, depending on cams recommended, what is the best thermostat, 160 or 180. Thanks for anyone's input. :icon_confused:
Ok I know you have a lot questions and they are good ones. Here are some simple answers:
Valve work. If you want to run a cam you should up the following on your heads:
LS1 Valve Springs 98 corvette (GM PN 12589774, 12 of them)
LS1 Shims 98 corvette (GM PN 12565118, 12 of them)
96 '3100 V6 valve spring retainers ( GM PN 10166344, 12 of them)
96 '3100 V6 valve key retainers (GM PN 10166345, only need 24 but get extras incase you drop them)
82' 2.8 V6 rocker arm studs and nuts (GM PN 476530 and 477212, need 12 but get extras again)
With this setup you will prevent valve float with that cam. If you want to be extra sporty you can get some 95 3100 V6 1.6 ratio rocker arms (stamped steel kind).
Tuning, talk to Adam, Flybynite. Working with him is always a pleasure and I learned how to tune my car myself eventually with his help. At the very least he can hook you up with a tune to get started but you are going to have to go to moates.net and get the stuff to start datalogging your car and reflashing your chip to get it as good as a factory setup.
Budget? If you want to do anything performance wise be prepared to spend some $$. Make a budget for how much you THINK it might cost to do it, then double it because that is what it will cost you in reality to do it right.
Ken
Quote from: cobracmdr on December 29, 2008, 09:14:10 AM
82' 2.8 V6 rocker arm studs and nuts (GM PN 476530 and 477212, need 12 but get extras again)
Ken
Why those? Stock style studs fit the 3100 1.6 rockers fine.
Quote from: TGed on December 29, 2008, 01:23:53 PM
Why those? Stock style studs fit the 3100 1.6 rockers fine.
You need those studs because with the LS1 springs you have to manually adjust the valve lash. You can just torque the nuts down anymore you will have to follow the gen1 valve adjustment procedure. But the motor will be much tighter with those springs in there. In fact I have a set of heads in the garage with that setup on it which is going to find it's way into the tgp eventually.
Ken
I am not saying you're wrong, I just never read that anywhere from all the folks that swap in those springs.
Is this just a 3.1/2.8 thing or is it across the board to the 3x00 engines also?
Thanks for the valve work info. I never could have come up with this setup if I tried. Which cam did you think was a better choice of the two listed? Also, I could not find cams with these specs on the Jegs or Summitt websites. Where were these particular cams found? Also, still need some injector info to run these
cams. Will either of these cams reach 6000 plus RPM and still be streetable? I anyone has these valve parts that were recommended or know someone that has them, please contact me or give me contact infor where I can contact them. Thanks again for all input. May this pushrod outperform these darned overhead cams!!!!!! :icon_biggrin:
I wouldn't try to get up to 6,000 RPM unless you have done some serious porting and have the valvetrain to support it..
When stock, these engines start running out of breath over 5,000 RPM.
Quote from: TGed on December 29, 2008, 02:00:41 PM
I am not saying you're wrong, I just never read that anywhere from all the folks that swap in those springs.
Is this just a 3.1/2.8 thing or is it across the board to the 3x00 engines also?
right I'm not disagreeing with you at all, if you JUST want to run 1.6 rocker arms all you need is them. If you want to run the valvespings you need the gen 1 studs to get the right opening and closing pressure.
Quote from: RICHTGP on December 29, 2008, 07:54:43 PM
Thanks for the valve work info. I never could have come up with this setup if I tried. Which cam did you think was a better choice of the two listed? Also, I could not find cams with these specs on the Jegs or Summitt websites. Where were these particular cams found? Also, still need some injector info to run these
cams. Will either of these cams reach 6000 plus RPM and still be streetable? I anyone has these valve parts that were recommended or know someone that has them, please contact me or give me contact infor where I can contact them. Thanks again for all input. May this pushrod outperform these darned overhead cams!!!!!! :icon_biggrin:
do a search of some of my old rebuild threads. I ran an engle turbo cam actually here is the specs:
(valve lift: in .458, ex .440) (Duration: in 260, ex 256)(cam lift: in 305, ex 295)(Duration at .050: in 216, ex 210)(Lobe center 114)
check out crane's website for the 2020 cam, Ryan (Rdubya) put that cam in the engine he build when he owned my current TGP. It is pretty civil and runs fine without the valvesprings and all that. Although I'm sure it could benefit from a little more spring pressure.
sure it will be streetable they are not wild cams. Honestly from what I have read a real wild cam on a turbo engine will not do all that much. You don't want lift you want valve duration to keep the valve open longer to get more air in from the turbo. You are going to need tuning for sure.
If you want stock injectors get some 22 lb early 90's TPI corvette injectors with the EV1 connector. They will drop in the manifold and connect to the stock wiring harness.
for good prices on the valve parts check out rockauto.com or call Gmotors.com they are caddillac dealer in florida. If you say you are an internet customer they will give you a great price on the parts. Everything I think ran me around $250 for the valve stuff.
Good luck and do a search there is a lot of this information posted on here. Especially about injectors too. Most of you guys on here like to run the 5.0 mustang injectors yellow tops I think you call them?
Ken
Quote from: cobracmdr on December 30, 2008, 07:58:41 AM
Most of you guys on here like to run the 5.0 mustang injectors yellow tops I think you call them?
Yes, they are C302 Yellow Top injectors. They have a better spray pattern than the old Multecs. I have a set in my TGP and it was a night and day difference in driveability over the factory Multec injectors.
Quote from: cobracmdr on December 30, 2008, 07:52:18 AM
right I'm not disagreeing with you at all, if you JUST want to run 1.6 rocker arms all you need is them. If you want to run the valvespings you need the gen 1 studs to get the right opening and closing pressure.
Shouldn't the install height and seat pressure be ideally the same if the lsx spring is being used? While the only thing that should change are the binding rates.
This has me confused as there is a gen 2 around here with lsx springs and stock studs. Been running around for a couple years like that.
I'm shooting for opening and closing forces per the crane website for a 2020 cam. I'm not sure what you guys are doing. If you don't have those spring force numbers you are probably getting less than ideal force out of the lsx springs and therefore are still getting valve float. But i'm not an expert but this makes sense to me.
With the adjustable studs you are getting more preload in the spring. Hookes law and all that jazz F=-kx where k is the spring constant of the spring and x being displacement. You get the idea.
Ken
I knew someone (you) spent a load amounts of time investigating into detail about this. I applaud that.
Personally I probably will sell my lsx springs and use the springs that come with my next cam like how I always done. It's easier and I never really push the envelope that hard with the rpm's or craZy lift. I try and make most power at the lowest rpm's possible.
Question: Did you measure the stock spring (new) and the (new) lsx spring height and pressures?
Is the reason these motor s run out of breath above 5000 rpm caused by valve float?
No its the poor LIM design. Valve float is from just crap springs GM slapped in there.
So you are saying springs will or wont help? If they will help, which ones in your opinion and what would the benefit be? Thanks
Also checked out the 2020 Crane cam, but was confused since it said the RPM range was idle to 4200 RPM> :icon_confused:
Quote from: RICHTGP on December 30, 2008, 04:50:16 PM
So you are saying springs will or wont help? If they will help, which ones in your opinion and what would the benefit be? Thanks
Springs won't help you on a stock application.
When you say stock application are you talking about stock bottom end and turbo? What if I am changing the cam? If I'm only upping the cam maybe I can leave everything the same and just change the cam and lifters. Any power increase this way? Thanks for any input.
Quote from: TGP Nick on December 30, 2008, 06:30:07 PM
Springs won't help you on a stock application.
ummm yes they will... All tgps experience valve float @ or around 4800rpm... Also I agree that the LIM sucks but we are forcing air through it so it will flow decent #s above 5k and don't forget that the smaller runners also create velocity..... For injectors I would recommend some Bosch design III found in the later model Camaros, Firebirds and Corvettes.. They are far superior to the older style injectors and can be found in 22lb flow rates for stock applications.. As for a cam, Like Ken said look for duration and do not worry to much about lift..
Right now the cheapest increase of power with minimal effort would probably be 1.6 rockers... Maybe a CAI if you can keep it on the cheap, injectors and then a tune.
The most expensive would be Cam, valve job and springs, complete Exhaust upgrade, port work and a bottom end refresh.
Start doing all that, you'll need to look into trans work, suspension mods, and to put icing on the cake, alky or meth injection.
Quote from: flybynite on December 30, 2008, 06:55:03 PM
ummm yes they will... All tgps experience valve float @ or around 4800rpm...
Seriously? How can you prove this? I'm not saying that I don't believe you, but it is kinda hard to believe this would happen on a stock application, especially at such low RPMs..
It is hard to prove Nick without a fast rate camera or a strobe light running on an engine with an open valve cover. Or some serious engineering work which I'm not about to do because I know it happens. Basically every spring has a natural frequency or surge frequency. When the RPM (RPM divided by 60 will give you the 1/s or Hertz of the engine at a specific RPM then this can be comparted to the Hertz natural frequency of the spring) of the cam lobe lines up or excites the natural frequency of the spring it will effectively resonante and amplify the force imparted on it. I see it all the time on vibration test of certain military sensor programs I happen to design which have high force compressions springs in them.
So what happens? The amount of force put out by the spring is partially reversed and the net force acting on the valve is less. This causes the valve to lag behind the cam lobe and "float occurs"
Or in other cases the spring just does not have enough force output to respond as fast as the engine is rotating. Could be either case.
Are these engines top end monsters? By no means. Is there more power to have and better throttle response? Yes. When I put the ls1 springs in my 2.8 it wanted to wind up easier if that makes sense. The engine felt tighter and more responsive. It was a worth while mod.
1.6 rockers will open the valve more, this will not make a big difference but it is easy if you are doing an LIM gasket at the same time. It is practically free so might as well right?
Really, if you don't have a chip in that thing get one. My tgp is relatively stock engine wise (other than the cam) and with increasing the boost and tweaking my topgun 160 chip I think I have a pretty solid performer. Certainly plenty of power for a daily driver/cruiser. Don't expect to go out there and beat a turbo gutted civic or a STI. I ran mid 14's and had a 2.8 v6 which at the end was capable of high 13's but it takes a lot of time and effort to get there. That and the car was down a lot!
The Crane H260 cam seems to be the cam of choice from what I hear, good gain in performance but still idles and drives as it should.
Guys check out this thread:
http://www.w-body.com/forum/index.php?topic=39094.0
Gutless used LS6 springs, but I don't think he used those rocker studs
Quote from: Dark Ride on December 31, 2008, 07:35:42 AM
The Crane H260 cam seems to be the cam of choice from what I hear, good gain in performance but still idles and drives as it should.
Guys check out this thread:
http://www.w-body.com/forum/index.php?topic=39094.0
Gutless used LS6 springs, but I don't think he used those rocker studs
Ok guys you can leave the stock springs in there with an aftermarket cam. But with an aftermarket cam you are only going to make a problem from the factory worse. Same if you don't get the valve force correct. Sure it will "work" but so does the stock cam so why don't you just leave it alone then. These motors were not designed for high reving high HP. They are for grocery getters which don't usually see above 4800 rpm. As much as I love the TGP it was an afterthought and was modified to do what it does, it was never intended to do what we do to them in the DESIGN phase of the engine. That is reality.
+ 1 Ken
Quote from: TGP Nick on December 30, 2008, 08:33:13 PM
Seriously? How can you prove this? I'm not saying that I don't believe you, but it is kinda hard to believe this would happen on a stock application, especially at such low RPMs..
I can prove it through countless datalogs of TGPs I have previously tuned. The reason this is hard for you to believe is the lack of experience you have in the auto world.. ;) I have been turning wrenches for 15 + years and I bought my first TGP in 1996.. How old were you in 1996?? :icon_rolleyes: Also 4800 is not considered low rpms.. Just pull your front valve cover and rev the engine to 4800 and you will see what I mean. Nick, I am not trying to bash you but you have a long way to go before you are building 400+hp engines and school is only going to teach you so much, You will need hands on experience and many years in the field before you can fully understand the physics of this matter...
I come from across the pond- in the motorcycle industry. I know very well what valve float is, and have experienced it, albeit at a much, much higher RPM. I was curious to how you found there was valve float is all. I have floated the valves on different bikes before, and you can feel it when it happened, and sometimes it may make a high pitched screech.
Don't bash me before you know me, because I do know a lot about engines, just not car engines specifically. I also have been turning wrenches for many years and currently in school to be a mc technician..
Like I said, I was just curious to how you found the valves floating.
Ok! So from the many replies I think I have it. Crane H260 cam, 1.6 stamped steel rockers, chip, 160 thermostat, and bosch 3 or ford yellow top injectors, and LS1 springs and seats. Thanks for everyone's input. Anyone have any of these parts to sell or know where I can purchase the m used at a good price?
Thanks so much for everones input and Happy New Year to all!!!!!!!!!! :icon_biggrin:
"sprayitracing" on ebay has the cheapest price on brand new Ford yellow/orange top injectors. They're rated at 19lb's, but actually flow right at 22lb/hr(I had some flow tested back in 2006).
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Set-of-6-19lb-19-lb-Ford-Fuel-Injectors-NEW_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQ_trkparmsZ72Q3a1205Q7c66Q3a2Q7c65Q3a12Q7c39Q3a1Q7c240Q3a1318Q7c301Q3a0Q7c293Q3a1Q7c294Q3a50QQ_trksidZp3286Q2ec0Q2em14QQhashZitem370132252795QQitemZ370132252795QQptZMotorsQ5fCarQ5fTruckQ5fPartsQ5fAccessories
Quote from: RICHTGP on January 01, 2009, 07:48:30 PM
Ok! So from the many replies I think I have it. Crane H260 cam, 1.6 stamped steel rockers, chip, 160 thermostat, and bosch 3 or ford yellow top injectors, and LS1 springs and seats. Thanks for everyone's input. Anyone have any of these parts to sell or know where I can purchase the m used at a good price?
Thanks so much for everones input and Happy New Year to all!!!!!!!!!! :icon_biggrin:
[/quote
I still have access to those rockers.
Quote from: TGed on January 01, 2009, 09:51:41 PM
I still have access to those rockers.
Do you have the guideplates from a 1.6 ratio car like he needs as well?
You dont NEED them, all you would have to do is grind the existing plates with a dremel cylinder grinding bit ($2.33 at your local lowes or home depot) about 1/16" of an inch.
(http://www.geocities.com/ericperez_2000/car/tools2.JPG)
I have a few Gen 2 vehicles, and I did the 1.6 rocker swap on all of them (One has the roller tip style) . The first one (roller tips) I just used the grinding wheel method, the other one I didn't even bother since the car is a Daily Beater that I literally BEAT the piss out of. The last vehicle I did the grinding method again.
No problems from any of the vehicles.
Roller tipped style are over rated. I will NEVER buy those EVER again. They are loud, require valve lash, and nearly impossible to install with LIM still on engine.
Quote from: TGP Nick on December 31, 2008, 07:53:52 PM
I also have been turning wrenches for many years and currently in school to be a mc technician..
Like I said, I was just curious to how you found the valves floating.
Sorry I underestimated your skills Nick, But If you had worded your post a little bit different I would not have been so defensive with my reply
Quote from: TGP Nick on December 30, 2008, 08:33:13 PM
Seriously? How can you prove this? I'm not saying that I don't believe you, but it is kinda hard to believe this would happen on a stock application, especially at such low RPMs..
Just re read it and you will see what I mean... But regardless I'm sorry if I upset you Nick, That was not my intention..
Back to the topic..
I have seen valve float in countless datalogs of cars I have tuned, not just TGPs. On TGPs it usually occurs @ or around 4800rpm. It starts by the A/F ratio starting to jump around a bit and soon knock counts occur. For those of you wondering why your car seems to loose power in the upper rpms this could be your problem...
Here is a link to some bosch design III injectors
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/LS1-Stock-GM-Fuel-injectors-NO-RESERVE_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQ_trkparmsZ72Q3a543Q7c66Q3a2Q7c65Q3a12Q7c39Q3a1Q7c240Q3a1318Q7c301Q3a0Q7c293Q3a1Q7c294Q3a50QQ_trksidZp3286Q2ec0Q2em14QQhashZitem130278094883QQitemZ130278094883QQptZMotorsQ5fCarQ5fTruckQ5fPartsQ5fAccessories
There are many auctions for these type injectors, these were the cheapest starting bid...
Interesting.. thanks ;)
Definitely want those 1:6 rockers. Let me know how much and when I can get them!! ;)
check your pm's
Quote from: TGed on January 02, 2009, 12:01:37 AM
You dont NEED them, all you would have to do is grind the existing plates with a dremel cylinder grinding bit ($2.33 at your local lowes or home depot) about 1/16" of an inch.
(http://www.geocities.com/ericperez_2000/car/tools2.JPG)
I have a few Gen 2 vehicles, and I did the 1.6 rocker swap on all of them (One has the roller tip style) . The first one (roller tips) I just used the grinding wheel method, the other one I didn't even bother since the car is a Daily Beater that I literally BEAT the piss out of. The last vehicle I did the grinding method again.
No problems from any of the vehicles.
Roller tipped style are over rated. I will NEVER buy those EVER again. They are loud, require valve lash, and nearly impossible to install with LIM still on engine.
I know they aren't needed, but it is much simpler to bolt on the 1.6 guideplates instead of doing any grinding. ;)
Here is my chance to be the nayser, I have never modified anything in the 3 cars I have put 1.6 ratio rockers in. Just bolt them in and go. I have not had ANY issues with this.
All I did when I put the 94-95 1.6 stamped rockers in, was swap the pushrod guides out for the newer style (deeper slots in the newer ones)
Rocker arm studs are the same.
Quote from: cobracmdr on January 04, 2009, 09:11:33 AM
Here is my chance to be the nayser, I have never modified anything in the 3 cars I have put 1.6 ratio rockers in. Just bolt them in and go. I have not had ANY issues with this.
Stock guide plates Ken? The stock ones in my car were rubbing pretty badly is why I swapped them out. I think I posted a picture in the stickied thread of where they were rubbing.
This is what happens when you don't grind the down correctly. These were with the crane 1:6 roller tip rockers........that was a big mistake getting those, had to readjust twice, then this happened driving from TX to CO. I had initially adjusted the lash then took a piece of a Manila folder to see if there was clearance between the pushrod and guide. I'll be putting the stamped steel ones on the TSTE with the newer guide plates. :icon_cool:
The way I see it, if your pulling the stamped 1.6 rockers from a donor car anyways, the proper guideplates are right there. Takes 5 mins extra work to remove those as well. No grinding required.
Was that after grinding or no grinding at all?
That is weird.... Even more weird IF it was grinded some.
Quote from: GOT2B GM on January 04, 2009, 02:56:49 PM
The way I see it, if your pulling the stamped 1.6 rockers from a donor car anyways, the proper guideplates are right there. Takes 5 mins extra work to remove those as well. No grinding required.
Well either way you have to remove the guides to do it "right" anyway. I just preferred modifying it my self since most engines that had the rockers was all sludged up and junk.
Quote from: TGed on January 04, 2009, 02:57:29 PM
Was that after grinding or no grinding at all?
That is weird.... Even more weird IF it was grinded some.
It was grinded, took a small round file, then sand paper to clean it up some. Both Kenny and I were surprised to find this.
I guess, I cleaned my rockers and guides with degreaser in a parts washer at work. :laugh:
The ones I got out of donor vehicles were fairly clean. One set had sludgy oil(not a milkshake, but the result of not changing the oil frequently enough) all over them though. I've pulled four sets so far. I still haven't installed them yet in my Red TGP, my other two GP's have them though.
Quote from: GOT2B GM on January 04, 2009, 03:06:34 PM
I guess, I cleaned my rockers and guides with degreaser in a parts washer at work. :laugh:
Well it was the fact that I didn't want to deal with the gunk getting to the guides (studs have to come out) . Plus my engine is clean while already having the plate for easy access. If it was not my tools, I woulda pulled them in a heart beat! lawlz
Quote from: GOT2B GM on January 04, 2009, 01:03:13 PM
All I did when I put the 94-95 1.6 stamped rockers in, was swap the pushrod guides out for the newer style (deeper slots in the newer ones)
Rocker arm studs are the same.
But what if you are changing the springs to the LS1 springs with the 1:6 rocker arms. Can you still use the stock studs or do they need to be replaced?
Will these injectors work in the TGP?
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/MUSTANG-GT-5-0L-GT40-19LBS-INJECTORS-SET-OF-8_W0QQitemZ180317672619QQcmdZViewItemQQptZMotors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories?hash=item180317672619&_trksid=p4506.c0.m245&_trkparms=72%3A543%7C65%3A12%7C39%3A1%7C240%3A1318
Help! I have tried to price a Crane H260 camshaft on Summitt and Jegs but they do not have it or list it. Where can I find one? :icon_mad:
Quote from: RICHTGP on January 04, 2009, 05:03:43 PM
Will these injectors work in the TGP?
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/MUSTANG-GT-5-0L-GT40-19LBS-INJECTORS-SET-OF-8_W0QQitemZ180317672619QQcmdZViewItemQQptZMotors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories?hash=item180317672619&_trksid=p4506.c0.m245&_trkparms=72%3A543%7C65%3A12%7C39%3A1%7C240%3A1318
Yes, They will work fine for a pretty much stock application...
I have a set of 22# injectors (it's either 22 or 23 I forget [3.4tdc] ) . I also might have some 28's. I doubt you'll need anymore than 22 or 23 for mild mods.
Hey!! Thanks for everyone's input. Have most items ordered and on the way. Have ordered H260 Comp Cams camshaft kit with lifters and timing chain; Aurora 23# injectors, 1:6 stamped steel rockers; LS1 valve springs and shims; Retainers, and keys. Still need input on who is tuning the chips for the TGP so I can talk with them and see what is needed for my car to perform with this new setup and what the cost will be. Thanks!! Can't wait to see if these upgrades make a noticeable difference and if so how much difference between the way it was. Please let me know if you know!! Thanks again. Mike :icon_cool:
Talk to Kenny (TGPilot) or Flybynite for your tune.
Kenny or Flybynite, Please PM if interested in doing my chip. Iwould like to talk with you about this! :icon_biggrin:
Has anyone run the 23# Olds injectors from an Aurora? Will they run good in a slightly modified TGP?
Have a great day!!!!!!!!
Realistically you could use 24# injectors and as long as you're tuned with the injectors is use, it'll be fine. Now if you slapped some 36'ers in there, tuning will get harder slightly and they'll be over kill.
With any injector upgrade though, you will NEED a tune, and with using 23# injectors, it should be simple enough to tune for while not "wasting" injector duty.
Kind of like having a cup for your drink. All you want is 8oz's, but you're stuck using a 20oz container since that is all what you have. You never quite fill it all the way but the extra space is there for when you get really thirsty or grow to "fit" the cup size.
Thanks. talked to Flybynite about the chip tune and I am going to get that done also.
+1 for Adam
Dropped the engine out of the body with the trans annd cradle attached. Removed the camshaft and sure enough #10 lobe was half the height of the other exhaust lobes. Problem found. Installed new H260 cam, LS1 springs, shims and retainers, lifters and am installing the 1:6 rockers. Is it required to modify the guideplates? Some say yes and some here say no. Also installed the 23# injectors into my rail. Hope she runs good when I get it back in! :icon_biggrin:
Yeah you will need to modify the guideplates. Another option is grabbing a set from a 94-95 3100 at the JY. Just bolts right in, no grinding required. ;)
If you do not grind out the stock guideplates for clearance, the pushrods will rub against the sides and bottoms of them. I'm not stating an opinion. ;)
ANYBODY HAVE ANY OF THE 82 MODEL 2.8 LITER STUDS AND NUTS? tHE GM DEALER IS RIDICULOUS!! :icon_evil:
You may want to try a JY for them ;)