Break teh 500hp barrier, and find some better stuff for the suspensino and brakes. I'm more of a road course guy anymore.

My Bad - F40 is Ferrari  you would think I would see more in Itlay...that is only the 2nd one in 5 months

I've only seen 1 in my ENTIRE LIFE, so you are already WAY ahead of me. They were extremely limited in production I believe.

Take a drive through Beverly Hills or southern Orange County. Its actually sickening when you see so many, including Ferraris (one past me on the freeway the other day, a Diable did a couple months ago) because you want one and it takes so much to own one.

Sorry, as far as the post, I always go by the rule of thumb "theres no replacement for displacement". How much is the 3.1 really capable of, we can pump it full of all the boost and maybe nitrous we want to, but there is a limit both of physical integrity and physical space that fuel/air can be compressed.

then again look at how much ass a nissan skyline kicks with a TT inline six setup, so who knows.

One thing that true pros have is a decent, sometimes overwhelming supply of aftermarket parts. We do not. They can say there running, say, a Dodge 440, chevy 350, whatever. BUT!!! what they dont necessarily say is they bought a custom forged block out of Jegs, aftermarket fully ported heads, etc etc....not one part is a "stock" part. we have limitations, and are reliant on each others creativity, skill, passion for the project and ultimately the pocket book. So keep trying. Ill let you know what happens w/me when i consider myself well along. Good luck!

TGPto_restore,

I see your signature says BOMBs better - for that as a service member a little to famialure with some of these Bombs - thank you!

Well thank you. You are definitely the man, doing the front lines, but were here supporting you giving the best tools we can, 100%!!!!


Dave

Quote from: TGPto_restoreTake a drive through Beverly Hills or southern Orange County. Its actually sickening when you see so many, including Ferraris (one past me on the freeway the other day, a Diable did a couple months ago) because you want one and it takes so much to own one.

Sorry, as far as the post, I always go by the rule of thumb "theres no replacement for displacement". How much is the 3.1 really capable of, we can pump it full of all the boost and maybe nitrous we want to, but there is a limit both of physical integrity and physical space that fuel/air can be compressed.

then again look at how much ass a nissan skyline kicks with a TT inline six setup, so who knows.

One thing that true pros have is a decent, sometimes overwhelming supply of aftermarket parts. We do not. They can say there running, say, a Dodge 440, chevy 350, whatever. BUT!!! what they dont necessarily say is they bought a custom forged block out of Jegs, aftermarket fully ported heads, etc etc....not one part is a "stock" part. we have limitations, and are reliant on each others creativity, skill, passion for the project and ultimately the pocket book. So keep trying. Ill let you know what happens w/me when i consider myself well along. Good luck!

I have to disagree with the post a bit. There is a replacement for displacement, it's called technology. While a SBC(350, 383, whatever it may be) can make awesome power, they are pretty much useles on the street after aout 500-600hp. Now, my Supra was making near 700whp, and I could drive it anywhere without issue, and it would still get around 22mpg. My DSM had about 390whp on a stock bottom end, and didnt give me any grief untill it hit the 195k mark. It was hitting above 300whp since it had 78k miles on it.

While the TGP engine is hard to make fast due to lack of aftermarket, there are NUMEROUS small displacement engines that can be built to run harder than the V-8's and for near the same price.

Quote from: maximage
While the TGP engine is hard to make fast due to lack of aftermarket, there are NUMEROUS small displacement engines that can be built to run harder than the V-8's and for near the same price.

you are definately right there....like the Turbo Dodge 2.2/2.5 for instance!  uh where is the '90 Daytona Turbo ES in your sig?  i never hear of idbeast mention his '89 Dodge Shadow ES Turbo in his sig either, but i had an '89 Shadow ES T1 in my GTS and i ran even with a friends '00 GTP with it (i have less than $500 into the GTS).  IMO boost replaces displacement and then some.

I'll will disagree with that and prove it wrong. NHRA Top Fuel dragsters are meant for nothing but the fastest possible 1/4 mile run. They run a nitro burning hemi-head V8 with a blower. A blower is not a supercharger either. They are not 4 or 6 cylinders. They are heavily forged, multi ignition, etc etc. They run 4 sec 1/4's. The latest non V8 1/4 fastest ive seen is 8 seconds, could easily be 7 by now. Even if its 6, thats still a ways from 4 and will never get there. People are far too reliant on the word technology today. And with the "technology" argument, before a 4 banger runs 4 sec 1/4's we'll all be in hybrids, hydrogens, or flying space ships.

So, I'm guessing you don't pay ANY attention to the NIRA.  The ecotec 2.2L is putting out OVER 1100 HP.  Kent Rudbeck here in Muncie has had his GN in the 7's for a couple years now.  I will admit though, he's run out of room, but that's not even the biggest 6 to be had.  He's running a Buick Racing 4.1 L block.  No, nitrous either.  (Afraid what would happen if he was running that  :lol: )  How is a "blower" different from a Supercharger?

Quote from: TGPto_restoreI'll will disagree with that and prove it wrong. NHRA Top Fuel dragsters are meant for nothing but the fastest possible 1/4 mile run. They run a nitro burning hemi-head V8 with a blower. A blower is not a supercharger either. They are not 4 or 6 cylinders. They are heavily forged, multi ignition, etc etc. They run 4 sec 1/4's. The latest non V8 1/4 fastest ive seen is 8 seconds, could easily be 7 by now. Even if its 6, thats still a ways from 4 and will never get there. People are far too reliant on the word technology today. And with the "technology" argument, before a 4 banger runs 4 sec 1/4's we'll all be in hybrids, hydrogens, or flying space ships.

I have a lot of disagreement with this. the Ectoec is in the 6's, and so is the honda B-series. The engines you speak of are in rail crs running 4's, these are in full tube chasis and bodied cars, running 6's.  

Oh, and a blower IS a supercharger. There are 2 types of supercharger. Roots type(blower) and wipple type(Vortech style, side mount).

One more thing to add. thoe rail car engines are usually torn down after every run, or at least close to it. Mos of the guys running Spo-coms dont even change engines after each race day. Yes, they have some extras if needed, but they do not get rebuilt after each pass.

Quote from: maximage


I have a lot of disagreement with this. the Ectoec is in the 6's, and so is the honda B-series. The engines you speak of are in rail crs running 4's, these are in full tube chasis and bodied cars, running 6's.  

Oh, and a blower IS a supercharger. There are 2 types of supercharger. Roots type(blower) and wipple type(Vortech style, side mount).

Which ecotec car is running 6's? I thought the fastest it has ran was high 7's if it's the Cavalier I'm thinking of.  http://www.dragracecentral.com/DRCStory.asp?ID=%7BC85F9D78-D334-4C77-999A-B9828831D404%7D  date on that article is June 14th...is THAT the fastest ecotec car?

EDIT: There are also more then two types of superchargers...there are the roots style, the centifugal style, screw, and G-ladder(pretty neat..based on an OLD design, they're used on those VW Corado's).

EDIT # 2: here's a link about the G-ladder sc http://corradog60.tripod.com/g60info.html

EDIT # 3(lol): I guess all superchargers are grouped into either a postive displacement(roots, screw) or centrifugal categorie.

Quote from: maximage
I have to disagree with the post a bit. There is a replacement for displacement, it's called technology. While a SBC(350, 383, whatever it may be) can make awesome power, they are pretty much useles on the street after aout 500-600hp. Now, my Supra was making near 700whp, and I could drive it anywhere without issue, and it would still get around 22mpg. My DSM had about 390whp on a stock bottom end, and didnt give me any grief untill it hit the 195k mark. It was hitting above 300whp since it had 78k miles on it.

While the TGP engine is hard to make fast due to lack of aftermarket, there are NUMEROUS small displacement engines that can be built to run harder than the V-8's and for near the same price.

Yes, you can use technology to make a smaller engine more powerful then one with more displacement, however if you use the same technology on the bigger displacement engine, it will make more power.  With all things equal for both engines, there is no replacement for displacement...period.

Shawn

Quote from: dbtk2

Quote from: maximage
I have to disagree with the post a bit. There is a replacement for displacement, it's called technology. While a SBC(350, 383, whatever it may be) can make awesome power, they are pretty much useles on the street after aout 500-600hp. Now, my Supra was making near 700whp, and I could drive it anywhere without issue, and it would still get around 22mpg. My DSM had about 390whp on a stock bottom end, and didnt give me any grief untill it hit the 195k mark. It was hitting above 300whp since it had 78k miles on it.

While the TGP engine is hard to make fast due to lack of aftermarket, there are NUMEROUS small displacement engines that can be built to run harder than the V-8's and for near the same price.

Yes, you can use technology to make a smaller engine more powerful then one with more displacement, however if you use the same technology on the bigger displacement engine, it will make more power.  With all things equal for both engines, there is no replacement for displacement...period.

Shawn

If that was the case, then why do they not run that technology and push those cars even harder? Because they have maxxed out the potential of the engine to make that kind of power and still make it down the track in 1 piece. They are getting closer every day to the funny car crazy speeds while running the little engines. Spcoms have not maxxed out the potential of their power plants yet, and have a few more years before they get close. I would be really surprised to not see a 6 cylinder in the 5's in the next 2-3 years.

The only advantage the larger displacement engines have is they have been around a LOT longer, so they have had the time to develope. The spocom market is still in it's fledgling stages. Give it a couple years.